Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

3 speed switch (Cyclone3000) How does it work?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    3 speed switch (Cyclone3000) How does it work?



    Are these fast and low RPMs set by the controller? And just how fast are they? Are they a cruse control? Or an under-drive and an over-drive? By triming or multiplying the voltage? If so by what percentage?

    I just bought a 52volt battery pack. And I want to keep it under 20mph and possibly even under 15mph. I just want to use my cycletruck for slow commuting and steep hill climbing with cargo.

    So how does it work? Lower the voltage (with the switch) and increase the amperage (with the accellerator) for hill climbing? And the higher voltage over-drive for crusing to save fuel? (If I don't use it to go faster)

    The switch needs to be a 3 position "on/off/on" single pole, right?
    Last edited by jawnn; 4 weeks ago.

    #2
    From what I've gleened from the internet...

    Originally posted by "John in CR" post_id=1091609 time=1440931323 user_id=6408

    A 3 speed switch does not necessarily limit power. It simply applies a percentage reduction to the throttle voltage. While it does lower power, it's more of an indirect result.
    If it doesn't get you in the range you desire, check out mod #2 in my Hall throttle thread... HERE.


    And yes to your last question as illustrated by Seb's excellent wiring diagram...


    Click image for larger version

Name:	fetch?id=57909&d=1520442585.png
Views:	1
Size:	248.3 KB
ID:	73788


    Regards,
    T.C.
    See my E-Bike build in progress HERE.

    Comment


      #3
      Also, if you choose the Bluetooth Cyclone controller, you can set the parameters for the three-speed switch, in percentage of under-speed (for the low-speed setting), and in percentage of over-speed (for the high-speed setting). The middle setting is your motor's normal performance range.

      Basically, if you set it to "energy" mode (low-speed), it'll lower the motor's top RPM to whatever percentage you have selected. If you set it to "normal" it's your regular RPM range, and if you set it to the high-position, it'll allow your motor to "overspeed" to whatever percentage you have selected (devouring your battery at an awesome rate, in exchange for an increase in top speed).

      What this also does, is affect throttle behavior. The throttle's range is divided across a narrower band of RPM in the low-speed mode, so it gives you sort-of a fine-tune throttle; while in the high-speed mode, the throttle is much more sensitive.

      Worth noting here, is that the Cyclone doesn't really sense your speed in any way, just how fast the motor itself is turning. If you use any gears at all, the speed-calibration on the Bluetooth controller will only be accurate in whichever gear you used for calibration.

      Basically, this means in order to get the precise speed-ranges you desire, you may need to do some trial-and-error, adjust, test, adjust, re-test, etc.

      If you do use gears (as most of us do), then you'll find yourself able to do a lot of things with your speed, speed-ranges, etc. If you want to climb very steep hills, with heavy loads, be sure you have very solid components, and brakes that are as capable as your Cyclone!

      As far as "cruise control" goes, there's a way to set that to operate manually or automatically.

      Automatic cruise control engages after you hold the throttle steady for about eight seconds. Then, it "holds" your selected throttle position, until you either activate the brakes (assuming e-brake cut-off switches), or if you activate the throttle again. Then, it cancels.

      I do not have any experience with using or wiring up the "manual" cruise-control. The automatic cruise-control requires no extra wires or buttons, so I saw no reason to further clutter the handlebars, when all it would do is just complicate the operation!

      Best of luck to you with your project!

      Take care,

      Tklop
      Last edited by tklop; 4 weeks ago.

      Comment


        #4
        If the switch affects the rpm without effecting the voltage to be lower, I think I should just leave off the over-drive wire. I am building a single speed reduced gear. But it still sounds like it will be good for keeping the speed down even if doesn't deliver more torque thrust.

        We figured out that about 533rpm at the motor's planitary gear's output will do about 13mph at about 1300 watts. But then I had to buy a 52volt battery in place of the 48v I planed for. Just becasue Luna was out of every thing else. So I may use an even lower gear. https://endless-sphere.com/forums/vi...85437#p1383245

        I was thinking about using hydroulic brake on the rear but then the ebrake cut-off levers I got would not be usable.

        What do they mean by “LOW” brake? Is that not a brake lever with shorting switch?


        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by jawnn View Post

          What do they mean by “LOW” brake? Is that not a brake lever with shorting switch?

          Electronic speed controllers may use up to three different types of brake signal inputs to deactivate power to the motor. Low... refers to using a 5vdc or less electronic signal and shorting it to ground with the brake actuation switch. (yes to your question) High... refers to a 12 vdc signal being provided to the proper pin by ether the brake switch, or perhaps by tapping into a 12vdc brake light power line. And a brake analog signal which uses a 5vdc supply which is varied in voltage depending on the brake lever position by use of a hall sensor or other means. This allows for variable regeneration.
          Last edited by Tommycat; 4 weeks ago.
          See my E-Bike build in progress HERE.

          Comment


            #6
            Three speed switch wiring??

            Which one is the slow RPM? Is it the blue with white stripe?

            And can anyone tell me what wattage the low rpm will limit to? I need 1300w to climb a 9%g hill with cargo.

            Comment


              #7
              Wattage is not limited with this switch in any way at all.

              The only thing this switch does is change the available operational RPM range of the motor. This range can be adjusted, if you have the Bluetooth Cyclone controller. I personally almost never use the high-speed position on the switch. Technically, the amount of over-speed can be turned to zero if you are worried about accidental activation.

              By changing other settings within the app, (the Bluetooth Cyclone controller app), you can indeed affect the amperage delivered by the controller. But technically speaking, Cyclone's controllers don't really care about watts; because they're built to operate at multiple voltages. Because Volts x Amps = Watts, a 36V system, pulling 60A max, will deliver 2160 Watts; a 72V system, pulling 60A max, will deliver 4320 Watts (simple math not accounting for any losses).

              Don't want the Bluetooth Cyclone Controller? Shell out more dough (many times the difference in price), and add a Cycle Analyst to the stock Cyclone Controller. I've never used one of those. But--if you want access to the adjustments that come standard with the Bluetooth Cyclone controller, I think the Cycle Analyst can give you those--and probably many more (for all I know).

              Personally, I like the Bluetooth Cyclone Controller. I never have to open the app, unless I want to change some settings. So, I just set it--and forget it. I have a Bluetooth app for my BMS--which gives me real-time amperage-draw, my current rate of speed, and estimated remaining range from it's main "dashboard" screen--and I do leave that open on my Android device often when I'm riding (my phone is firmly attached to the handlebars). But other times, I just run "dashboard-free". Switch it on--and off I go--in total darkness, if I like!

              As far as which color wires go where, I know I have seen two different wiring diagrams, both used different color schemes. And, since I'm not willing to take my working 3-speed switch apart, just to answer your question--I'm afraid I cannot tell you with authority what the "real-world" item's specific wire-colors are.

              I am sorry about that. But maybe somebody can crack open a busted one and give you that exact info!

              Honestly, I find the stock 3-speed switch clunky. In addition to the "three-speed" function switch (actually designed for turn-signal activation) it also has a "momentary" button (with a horn-symbol on it), and a SPST switch (with a headlight-symbol on it). So, it's a 3-in-one kind of thing. And it's pretty bulky. Still, the other switch-functions can be handy. Just like "re-purposing" the turn-signal-switch to act as a three-speed-switch, the other two switches may be used for whatever you like. If I ever put a horn on the bike, I may make use of the momentary switch--for its original purpose--but for now I leave it unused. However, I did set the "headlight" switch to control the PAS ON/OFF function--before I realized that I don't like the PAS at all... So, I never use that switch either. Really, I could use a smaller single-purpose switch, and I expect I'll change to that eventually.

              Technically, any 3-position SPDT should be able to be used (that would be the on-off-on kind of switch).

              Best of luck to you!

              Take care,

              Tklop
              Last edited by tklop; 3 weeks ago. Reason: for clarity

              Comment


              • jawnn
                jawnn commented
                Editing a comment
                well it does sound like it is the perfect solution to the legal speed limit problem. So I will have to set it up with a single throw witch and test it out. Then report back here just incase someone else wants to know about it.

              #8
              How do I know if I got the right kind of brake levers? They look simple enough, but should I test if the switch in levers connects or disconnects?


              Originally posted by Tommycat View Post


              Electronic speed controllers may use up to three different types of brake signal inputs to deactivate power to the motor. Low... refers to using a 5vdc or less electronic signal and shorting it to ground with the brake actuation switch. (yes to your question) High... refers to a 12 vdc signal being provided to the proper pin by ether the brake switch, or perhaps by tapping into a 12vdc brake light power line. And a brake analog signal which uses a 5vdc supply which is varied in voltage depending on the brake lever position by use of a hall sensor or other means. This allows for variable regeneration.

              Comment


                #9
                Originally posted by jawnn View Post
                How do I know if I got the right kind of brake levers? They look simple enough, but should I test if the switch in levers connects or disconnects?
                You can easily check the switches by measuring resistance if you desire. Open contacts when not braking, closed contacts when actuating brakes...
                But being so straight forward you could just hook them up, and check for correct operation. Will not damage anything if switches are wrong... Motor runs no brake, motor off with ether brake enabled. Of course variable brakes are different.
                See my E-Bike build in progress HERE.

                Comment

                Working...
                X