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    #16
    Time to kick off some actual build pics. While I have received a TON of parts already, I am not going to do a "parts pile" pic. I will show pics of each part as I use them. So first up was to get an access panel opening in the bottom of the tank. It comes entirely sealed minus the single small evaporation/ condensation hole from factory. The cut is not the straightest, but it is on the bottom of tank, and once trim has been installed on edges it will not be able to be seen.PICS!!:

    Comment


      #17
      Idearat.......Why the drum brakes? With the weight and power an ebike has, I would think they would get too hot and start feeling "mooshy". I have never had drum brakes so I am just regurgitating what I have read online. Maybe that has changed? I use a Nexus 3 IGH on my "old" ebike. It has given me ZERO issues over hundreds of miles on my BBSHD and I am a throttle junkie. I would worry about the 5 speed tho. Everything I have seen says except for the Nuvinci 380 and Rholoff Speedhub, the ONLY IGH's to use on mid-drives are Shimano Nexus 3 spd, and Sturmey 3 spds. Those 2 have a solid shaft for gear 2, both have large pawls for gears 1 and 3. All the other IGH's have weak spots that cannot take the torque without self destructing. Because I knew NOTHING about ebikes before the last build I went with what this article(and many others) said: https://www.electricbike.com/mid-drive-kit-igh/
      My new build will likely have the Sturmey Archer 3spd IGH instead of the Nexus due to Shimano seems to only have a 32H with disk brake. I need 36H, which Sturmey does make. S-RK3. That will be laced to the 65mm rims I got from Ruff-Cycles. Im still debating on just using my BBSHD and adding a better controller, or buying a QS205. By the looks of all the parts in my bedroom, I think I have time to debate it still.
      Hoping the weather breaks soon. I got parts to prime and paint!

      Comment


        #18
        Update: I decide NOT to use the "Z" bar Handlebar from Ruff-Cycles like they put on the Ruffian. I want it to look more like the old cafe racers and such. I have been looking at a few options. I would like some feedback and any options or opinions on ones i may not have seen. These are what I am looking at now:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/NITTO-B603A...r/291359103641
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wald-898-Ch...e/302889968079
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-BEACH-C...E/152722788747
        Which do you guys like? Like a better one? Show me the link.........
        Other parts that are changing from the original Ruffian to "My Ruffian":
        Headlight:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/Chrome-Head...72.m2749.l2649
        The bucket will get painted to match frame and tank
        Headlight trim:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/g-chrome-wi...72.m2749.l2649

        Tail light:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/USA-Vintage....c100148.m2813
        The bucket will get painted to match frame and tank. License plate bracket removed.

        Lights, Turn signal, Horn controls:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/Motorcycle-...72.m2749.l2649
        Will be modified to fit left handlebar with the thumb throttle

        Turn signals:
        https://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-Motorcyc...72.m2749.l2649
        These will get modded into the headlight and tail light to be "invisible" unless turned on.

        While there are MANY more items to post, I gotta spred the love over the build process. Look for more pics and info to come!!

        Comment


          #19
          Originally posted by Defjr333 View Post
          Idearat.......Why the drum brakes? With the weight and power an ebike has, I would think they would get too hot and start feeling "mooshy". I have never had drum brakes so I am just regurgitating what I have read online. Maybe that has changed?
          I've never used drum brakes either, so crossing my fingers. Went with the larger 90mm both front and rear. Makes for a clean, more vintage look for one. Having the style of a teens-20s motorcycle but with modern looking disc brakes seems out of place. I do most of my riding on the flats, just normal riding not mountain biking on hills. The rear hub, with the drum brake, has been used on pedicabs, so I think it's been proven. Not affected by rain or mud. Like the IGH, everything is internal and stays clean.
          I ordered hidden cable ebrake sensors to put low, at the brakes also. This means a pair of cables that do not need to go up to the handlebars.
          And while I've yet to use the drum brakes, like most other things on the internet, most of the people talking them down have never used them either.

          Comment


          • BK Xray
            BK Xray commented
            Editing a comment
            I have drum brakes on the front of our tandem trike. Fully loaded with both riders, 2 batteries, hub motor and gear, we're pushing close to 450 pounds. No "mooshy" feeling on the drum brakes. The 90 mm SA drums are used on velomobiles that hit really high speeds downhill. They also use drum brakes for drag brakes on tandem bikes because they can handle the heat. The SA 5 speed is listed as heavy duty so it should handle the power okay. It isn't as easy to change the chainline as the 3 speeds but with a long chainline it shouldn't be an issue. I'm considering using it on our tandem if I switch over to a BBSHD.

          #20
          Got some work done today. All parts except the tank are now primed. Still need to make a few holes in the tank for cables and wires before I can prime it. Hopefully get that taken care of tomorrow. The 2k paint and clear coat should be in monday. Now just need a nice day as I cant do the paint like I did the primer(in shed with a heater). That 2k stuff is dangerous. Dont want to paint my lungs. So, knowing everyone likes pics, here you go:

          Comment


          • paxtana
            paxtana commented
            Editing a comment
            That's a neat pic. Somehow I doubt my wife would let me lay my bike parts on the bed lol

          #21
          Have you test fit the BBSHD on the Bassman frame? The plate that holds the bottom bracket looks "different" enough to make it not obvious how it looks when installed. When I got the Parucho frame I knew others had put the motor on it. All the photos I saw had it outside the frame, but I really wanted to put it inside, if possible. Outside it ft great. Snugged up tight the motor was not the lowest part of the bike. Trying to put it inside the frame it "almost" fit, so tonight I took a dremel to it and removed the part of the motor case that took one of the screws for the mounting ring. It slides on now with only a bit of clearance. I'll perform the same surgery on the mounting ring and just use the single screw. The fit is so close I'm considering some hard rubber bumpers on either side since the motor really can't go anywhere.
          Now, all wires and cables can go within the frame perimeter.

          Comment


            #22
            Thats looking nice idearat. Yes, my BBSHD will be inside the frame, and test fit only showed one spot that is close but that is with the motor almost sitting on the bottom tube.. if elevated 1/4" above bottom tube it slides in fine. My frame also had 2 holes made during the construction of the frame that where re-inforced with brazed "eyelets" around the holes. They are to run all the BBSHD motor wires to the tank INSIDE the frame tube. the only wires that should be visable when done will be from handlebars to the tank, and the rear wheel to the tank. Of course the exposed parts will be using the cable stays to route TO the tank. Still thinking about running the wires and cables that will be visable inside a housing. Thinking of cutting the ends off of something like this, painting and clearcoat to match:
            https://www.lowes.com/pd/EASTMAN-5-f...nector/3190279
            But I do need to confess I have changed up the hubs I am going to use. I was so interested in your design, I started researching them. Well now, I am going to steal/ borrow/ flat out gank your idea:)
            Sorry brother, unless you view it in a flattering light. I ordered the Sturmey 90mm hubs.
            Rear
            https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/hubs-int...-hole/?geoc=US
            Front
            https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/hubs-int...-hole/?geoc=US

            I thought your idea of seeing less crap would look better. And the disc brake would have stood out to much as you thought. And upon some more reading due to your ideas, I found the 90mm front BENDS FORKS!!!! So they gotta be better than the rim brakes i use on my current BBSHD bike. See, you really do need a build page if nothing else for me to plunder some great ideas. Thanks and sorry if I offended on stealing that for my similar build.
            Additionally I have decide for now I am just going to do this with the BBSHD. Maybe down the road I will change over to hub motors, but for my use I dont need much more speed. While my current bike is lighter than this new one will be, I do have a couple things that can offset that. That, and I like knowing that all the drivetrain parts are still LUNA at the core. I may have had a few disagreements in the past, but LUNA has ALWAYS done right for me. Thank You.
            Last edited by Defjr333; 03-05-2019, 08:51 PM.

            Comment


            • JPLabs
              JPLabs commented
              Editing a comment
              You can get stainless braided loom, similar to what is on that water hose you linked, as just the outer braid. It's sold to dress up coolant hoses on cars. Like fake AN plumbing...

              It comes in a few diameters, and each can be stretched to fit a range, just like nylon braided wire loom. Check your local automotive bling store, Pep Boys or similar. You might like it.

              Looks like this.
              https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...fkMsLsxn0UEwFy

              Sorry can't format link in a comment. Copy/ paste, it's just an image link.
              Last edited by JPLabs; 03-07-2019, 01:14 PM. Reason: added link

            #23
            Just noticed your post about the bike on the bed Pax........SHE HAS NOT SEEN THE PICTURES.....its all in the timing:-)

            Just an update on the progress the past few days. Have test benched my electrical system. It consists of the following items wired together to give me Low/High beam headlamp, Horn, Front and Rear Turn signals, Rear light w/ brake light, Battery BMS monitor, Alarm, GPS Speedometer, Front and Rear dashcams, and Music:
            Starting at the handlebars:
            Left side switch
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/Motorcycle-...72.m2749.l2649
            Turn Signals
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/2x-Motorcyc...72.m2749.l2649
            Headlamp
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/Chrome-Head...72.m2749.l2649
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/g-chrome-wi...72.m2749.l2649
            Tail Lamp
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/USA-Vintage...72.m2749.l2649
            Power Source
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-36V-48V-...72.m2749.l2649
            Stereo Amp
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-36V-48V-...72.m2749.l2649
            Alarm
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/Motorcycle-...72.m2749.l2649
            Dashboard/ Phone Interface
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/Smart-Speak...4AAOSwzOxcdWoq
            Flasher Relays (2)
            https://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-LED-Tur...72.m2749.l2649

            These parts will let me control headlights, tail light, turn signals, and horn from my left thumb. Additionally, it allows me to expand on my Alexa Moto Mod for my Moto Z3 phone. On my current bike, I have the Alexa Moto Mod attached to the stem and my phone just snaps on. It gives me my Speedometer App, and music thru voice command. The new build adds bluetooth BMS monitoring, Access to the hidden front and rear cameras, the mating of the phone to the Alexa Mod will be the actual "ignition key" that signals a relay to the BBSHD controller as well as turning off alarm when placing onto mount. I will be sending the analog audio source out of the Alexa into a small amp and external speakers. I have not decided on the speakers or bluetooth BMS to use yet. Here is a pic of the Alexa mod on my current bike:

            Last edited by Defjr333; 03-05-2019, 09:30 PM.

            Comment


            • JPLabs
              JPLabs commented
              Editing a comment
              Those are some innovative features for packaging and integrating your controls and electronics! I think you just set the bar.

              Phone unlocks bike. Camera views. Routings. All of it. Awesome.

            #24
            Appreciate the comment JPLabs, but it is way easier than you would think. I am just removing the internal speakers on the Alexa mod, sending that to a cheap little 12v audio amp, and the mod has an LED light bar that lights up when you connect your phone to it. So i removed the LED strip and wired that to a relay, and tied that to the BBSHD org/ brn wires on harness(if i remember correctly), and also to a cheap motorcycle alarm to deactivate it at the same time. The rest are just aps on the phone, and the motorcycle switch on the left handlebar. While I want a lot of features the Ruffian never offered, they were simple and inexpensive to do. If people show interest in that part, I can put up schematics(very basic) and some pics or a vid. I bought some 5 1/4" speakers and they are MUCH louder than the Alexa was on its own. I do still need to get the BMS with bluetooth and change it out on the battery pack, but that is just a bluetooth connection, no wires other than inside the battery itself. Cameras are cheap 12v "spy" cameras with wifi connection to phone. Accessable by app. The Alarm does also come with a keychain remote for those times wind or something else sets it off. All those items use 12v dc so wiring them to a 52v-12v converter which is also on the power relay was easy. All in all those parts took maybe an hour to figure out and get wired up, and under $100 (except Alexa mod...already had)
            Sadly the biggest problem I am having is THE WEATHER! It has been under 50 degrees since I got the first part.......I need atleast one, preferably 2 days above 50 to paint and clear. Then I can get some real progress. The only parts still waiting on are the hubs(and their little bits), spokes, and direct mount kickstand(all ordered and on way). I still need to decide on handle bars, bms, and chain.
            Once it is finished I will test it for about a week to see how the power level is. If it is too slow, I may go with the Grin Phaserunner and change it over to 72-80v. Or maybe somebody at Luna could be sweet talked/ bribed/ flat out begged for a Ludi controller. I prefer the later to keep it all Luna drive components.

            Comment


              #25
              Now, since I am waiting for some decent weather/ temps for paint and clear, I need to decide if I am going to have anything painted/ stenciled on the sides of the tank(where the original says "The Ruffian"). I do not want mine to say "Ruffian". It is MUCH more than a Ruffian at this point. SO......any ideas from you guys? The style and colors no doubt scream classic, and or antique. But, I am thinking something that also portrays LUNA in the name. Hell, with as many people I get stopped to talk with about my current ebike, this one may make it where I spend more time meeting strangers talking about the bike than I will actually ride it(not really I will ignore them eventually). The point is, the area I live in(45 mins from DC at the base of the Blue Ridge Mtsof VA), people just freak out at ebikes. There are not many around. And those that do are way over priced and under powered.I talk up Luna so much I sometimes think I need an employee shirt. lol. But seriously, it would be great to acknowledge Luna on this. At the end of the build, I think the price, stats, and quality will put the Ruffian to shame. And if Luna wants to use that to sell a model based off it, I think it would FLY out the doors. Not many Cruiser style pre-built ebikes out there. And those that are suck. My guesstimat for this build stands at $2486. But that is all RETAIL PRICES paid on equipt. I would think a company could build it for considerably less. And your competition is a 250 watt $5500 bike. Had it existed already, I would have bought it.
              So help me figured out a name for this beast. Maybe even a small airbrushed scene on each side.

              Comment


                #26
                Originally posted by Defjr333 View Post

                Appreciate the comment JPLabs, but it is way easier than you would think.
                .
                .
                .
                Now, since I am waiting for some decent weather/ temps for paint and clear, I need to decide if I am going to have anything painted/ stenciled on the sides of the tank(where the original says "The Ruffian"). I do not want mine to say "Ruffian". It is MUCH more than a Ruffian at this point. SO......any ideas from you guys? The style and colors no doubt scream classic, and or antique. But, I am thinking something that also portrays LUNA in the name. Hell, with as many people I get stopped to talk with about my current ebike, this one may make it where I spend more time meeting strangers talking about the bike than I will actually ride it(not really I will ignore them eventually). The point is, the area I live in(45 mins from DC at the base of the Blue Ridge Mtsof VA), people just freak out at ebikes. There are not many around. And those that do are way over priced and under powered.I talk up Luna so much I sometimes think I need an employee shirt. lol. But seriously, it would be great to acknowledge Luna on this. At the end of the build, I think the price, stats, and quality will put the Ruffian to shame. And if Luna wants to use that to sell a model based off it, I think it would FLY out the doors. Not many Cruiser style pre-built ebikes out there. And those that are suck. My guesstimat for this build stands at $2486. But that is all RETAIL PRICES paid on equipt. I would think a company could build it for considerably less. And your competition is a 250 watt $5500 bike. Had it existed already, I would have bought it.
                So help me figured out a name for this beast. Maybe even a small airbrushed scene on each side.
                Just because you were able to implement the controls easily, does not make it less impressive. Taking a bunch of components and patching them together in a new, better way - that's a true 'hack' and worthy of praise, in my book.

                As for the graphics, I think Luna would appreciate your sentiments quite a bit. I believe Ashley is a graphics artist, and I bet she might have some cool Luna graphics. It can't hurt to ask if she or Luna may have a few neat graphics you could look at and use? Even if not decals today, you just need a graphics file. If it works out, maybe others will do the same.

                A 'Luna Builders' graphics set or decal options which we could use to badge our own builds is a cool idea.

                I've thought about this before. One idea I had is an ebike flying in front of the moon, with crossed wrenches behind the moon. Moon for Luna. Scene props have to go to E.T., with crossed wrenches reminiscent of the Jolly Roger flag & hacker badges.

                I agree that a bike like this would sell!
                Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.

                Comment


                  #27
                  I put a request up on the requested products page for logos/ decals/ graphic files for local print. Will see what happens....I am hoping they can help me out there. I really need to just send them an email with a few things I am hoping they can help out with. I also need to ship back a bbshd core to them but lost the info on where to send.

                  Comment


                    #28
                    Now this was an unexpected Youtube find:
                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viSJsOUCGu4
                    Gorgeous views.....But some of those bridges are just No Way!! Please also be sure to only used decommissioned tracks:-)

                    Comment


                      #29
                      I have officially had my first "oh cr@p" moment for this build. Let me start by saying this is ALL MY FAULT. I decided to change the hubs I am going to use on this build. I was going to use Sturmey Archers SX-RK3 with disc brakes, and just whatever was recommended for the front to use disc brakes. But I liked the way IdeaRat was going with the internal drum brakes. Mostly for looks, but also for weather. So I contacted a company that is listed as a very reliable Sturmey Archer dealer, https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/.
                      The Sturmey Line had me very confused compared to the Shimano I used on my last build. I thought I had all my ducks in a row, so to speak, but now that they have arrived (the hubs....no ducks were mailed) I did a quick test fit. DOUH!!!!!
                      The rear Hub (XL-RD3) fits into the rear dropout, but does not have much thread left past the frame. The front hub(XL-FD), well, it barely even touches the forks. I know I should have measured the front and rear dropouts, but I did not have them in my possession yet when I ordered everything. With Ruff-Cycles not being co-operative at all in giving me info via email to get that info, I ASSUMED they would be fine. Well dont know about U, but I sure feel like an @ss.
                      So, I have emailed SJSCycles for their recommendation. I DO NOT BLAME THEM! Even though I contacted them and asked recommendations etc before ordering, it was MY failure to obtain measurements that caused this. I hope to hear back from them tomorrow as they have always replied within 24 hours for me. THAT alone makes me feel a little better. Hoping they can do something for me. So, anyone out there with ideas on getting this to work? I am fairly sure I can "cold set" the rear dropouts to obtain the extra clearance needed, but the front scares me as it is not even close. To make matters more complicated, the reason I assumed they would fit fine, was these are Sturmey Archers WIDEST axle IGH with drum brakes. So, if these cannot be made to fit, i may have to resort back to the SX-RK3 with disc brakes and a generic hub up front with disc brake. UHHG.
                      I am waiting with baited breath for anyone here or SJS to give me some good ideas/ news............

                      Comment


                      • idearat
                        idearat commented
                        Editing a comment
                        You had me worried for a bit, but checked and my parts should fit. Your rear hub is too small for the frame but if you can swap it for the RX-RD3 you'll have one with the 135mm width vs your 118mm width. That's with a 70mm drum, it looks like the "R" version with the 90mm has been discontinued. The fork though just seems to be too wide. The spec for the double down fork on Ruff's site says it's 100m between the dropouts, which matches the XL-FD specs. Something's wrong with that fork, either it's bent out or it's made for a fat bike with that width. Ruff should sort that out for you. A normal 100mm wide fork should work OK.
                        http://www.sturmey-archer.com/en/products/detail/rx-rd3
                        Last edited by idearat; 03-12-2019, 11:32 PM.

                      #30
                      SJS replied this morning. And as I expected, the rear should probably work just fine as I can get a few mm extra by a very slight "cold set" to the rear dropouts. Which is good as I use the rear brakes A LOT as a drag and I would worry about the smaller 70mm drum being sufficient. The front however is a different story. I have decided I have 2 options. 1- buy a new front fork. 2- find the 2 cross brackets that would fit these tubes, but be proper width. I WILL NOT deal with Ruff-Cycles ever again. It will have to be a resolution without them. I have purposely not trashed them on this build log up to this point because I have been in a dispute with them since my order arrived. That will have a separate post in this log, maybe later today I will type that up. But I WILL NOT return, buy, replace, or recommend Ruff-Cycles EVER.
                      So anybody that would like to chime in on where I could get just the cross braces to replace the ones on this fork that would be the proper width to make this hub work would be SOOOO appreciated. If I cannot find a way to do that, I will just but an all new fork.
                      Also an update on the tank "logo":
                      After talking with Pax from Luna, I feel comfortable being allowed to have logos professionally made with LUNAs name. It appears they wont come hunt me down for it:-) The idea is to have the word LUNACYCLES but the CLES will be done like a Ghost flame. Some angles it will appear LUNACY, while others it will appear LUNACYCLES, this will be with an Apollo image of the moons surface in the background. The test ones have looked amazing with the Moons monotone light grey/ brown against the dark chocolate color the bike will be. I think it should turn out great, but any other ideas out there feel free to throw them my way.

                      Comment


                      • JPLabs
                        JPLabs commented
                        Editing a comment
                        I really like that idea for the graphic!
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