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To Build a Better Ruffian, I need YOUR HELP

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    The problem lies in using this frame itself for a mid-drive motor set-up. It is a "stretch" frame. Assembled and measuring tip of tire to tip of other is 6'8". A very long bike. On top of that, it is a "feet forward" design for a more relaxed, upright position. It is a true cruiser meant to go low and slow. It also is only 2.75" from the ground to bottom of frame. Being so long requires two(2) chains linked together, with the second chain approx 1/3 of it cut off before linking the ends with the snap on connector. The chain I am currently using are identical KMC S1 1/2"x 1/8". Not the best, but not horrid. The length is the problem. With human power, the small amount of sag is not a problem. But add the torque of the BBSHD and that sag allows a few teeth to "skip" across the chain. It also does not help I am using a 12 tooth rear cog. Wanted to keep the top end as close to my last bike as I could. Trade offs. I am also using a 48 tooth front. It is actually a nice combination with the 3spd IGH in 2nd, which the the direct drive gear any ways. So not wanting many more trade offs, I decided to make a easy chain tensioner set up. I used brackets meant for lights, but they are nice all aluminum and will get painted to match bike when my paint arrives(paint I had was bad) and fix a few spots then as well. I bolted a roller wheel to those before installing the brackets on the seat post downtube. I had to cut the rear fender in those 2 spots, and made the holes a bit bigger than I like, so I ordered a new set of fenders(front one got damaged any way so works out). They where only $30. But I got it all on and it not only works great, but looks cool too. They pinch the top and and bottom chain to make it nearly parallel from the rear cog for 1/2 the distance of the chain. It also forced a few additional teeth on both the front chain ring and the rear cog. On top of those benefits, The rollers keep the chain from swaying side to side and scratching the rear fender( well the new one anyway). I also installed new "clips" on the rear axles that make tensioning easy. Triple win.I got the new turn/light/horn switch installed, and all works finally. Finally got my friend(software genius) who wrote me an app for my Moto Z3 phone. When my phone is place on the dock attached to the bike, it turns the bike power on and launches my new app. That app has access to DS Speedometer, Google Maps, Bikeometer, Rain Alarm, and Amazon Music. The mount is a modified Alexa moto mod, with parts from the moto mod design yourself kit. That is now finally fully functioning. I do look a bit strange cruising down the street, keeping up with traffic, while yelling at Alexa to do something. But, I now do not have to take my hands off the handlebars ever, unless I want to. So now I am down to just the new fenders(5-10 days), the touch up painting(same time because its 2k paint only good for 24 hours from 1st spray), and the saddle bags(7 days per tracking). Once the saddle bags are on, you wont even see the chain tensioner I put on. It will also cover the brake and shift cable, making the rear end look cleaner and less mechanical stuff shown.
    On a side story, I wish I had the saddle bags today. I took it out for a test run at 7:45 EST to check the new set up. Ran GREAT! From dead stop on a slight incline at a light, I was able to go full throttle(not something I plan to do often) with NO chain skip. It was also quieter. No more sound of chain smacking into the fender on bumps, or hard corners. But back to test run. After tooling around town for 15-20mins, I see bout 35 classic cars at the Arbys. So I cruise over to look at some. Here is why I wish I had the saddle bags. I could have put the Hasselblad(spell?) camera mod on my phone and got some cool pics. But I have nowhere to store stuff atm. Turns out they do it every week during summer, so I will be going back when bike is 100%. And take some pics of it beside some super nice rides, some even era appropriate for the look of my bike. Or so I thought. I had around 5 people talking to me about my bike, like I was in with the cars...lol. Then I realize, all the people at the cars are the spectators, and many of the car owners where over talking to me. Fun meeting people and just cutting loose. I also wish the cameras were working today(buddy having issue with the app for the cams working nice with the moto mod app). Luckily its all programming issue and I dont go there, but my friend will. Never cared for coding.
    Thats all I got done today on the bike. Most of my punchlist. Will use tomorrow to do some more "test runs". And get some pics. Speaking of pics, I will try to post some of the parts I used for my tensioner set up. hope they not too big

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      Quick pic before going out on for a ride. U can see the spots cut in rear fender are too big. That will be fixed and paint the brackets as well. Got around to putting the decals on as well.

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        Wow, look at the teeth on that chainring, just huge! I love it.
        By the way, you can use a hair rubberband to wrap around the brake lever and the grip - since you use the cut-off brake levers it should help with any unwanted motor actuation.
        I wanted to ask, since you use your phone to control the bike do you even need the original display up there on the stem?

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          I actually don't use the brake levers with cuttoffs. Mine are sturmey Archers. I found the issue causing the auto throttle. It was a solder joint on the main harness. I put the Luna display on so I can adjust programming and pas on the fly. I will prob hide it in the tank later tho

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            I have no idea how they do it, but jasol-craft on eBay got my leather saddle bags to me from firggin India to Virginia USA in 5 days. Just wow. Nicely made, hand crafted leather saddle bags. Shipped with tax total cost of $55!!!! I highly recommend this guy.

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              So happy to have some storage. Can take my charger, minimal tools, an extra shirt, rain cover for phone/ display and still have 1/2-2/3 of each bag empty and usable. Paint also arrived today. Just need the 2 new fenders and I am finally finished. Not counting any upgrades/ changes I may decide on. I am leaning heavily toward the upgraded controller, be it a Ludi or a Phaserunner. I would like a little more torque from a standstill. I also plan on swapping back to the 14 tooth cog at the back. It shouldn't affect the top end too much.

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                I just wanted to make a dedicated post on these saddle bags. The ebay seller Jasol-craft store has many styles, sizes, and colors to choose from. The prices are extremely reasonable, and the quality is awesome. I recommend this guy to anyone looking for leather saddle bags(also sells wallets/ belts/etc). I took my bike out for a test run to check if they would interfere with anything, and they are perfect. Thank you Jasol-craft. https://www.ebay.com/str/nadolcraft?...p2047675.l2563

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                  Fenders arrived today. Hope to prime/ paint and fix a few spots elsewhere on the bike this fri/ sat. Also managed to weigh this thing. It sets at 98.7lbs!!!! Thats a heavy bike! I know many will say you could have/ should have used aluminum frame/ tank and other light weight parts instead of the all steal frame and parts I chose. I was actually WANTING this to be around 100lbs. My last bike was too light for the power. Big trucks would blow me over or nearly. This one I no longer have that problem. I dont ever plan on riding this thing without pas or throttle EVER. 100lbs for everything I shoved into here doesnt seem bad to me. I took a few pics of bike that I was going to submit to Luna(finally) for their advertising, but decided to wait until the fenders are replaced. Dont want any one zooming in to a dent or bad scratch. lol. I should have those pics and a video for Luna on monday.

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                    Had a strange problem today. Out of the blue, my Sturmey Archer XL-RD3 hub decided it wanted to have issues. At 30mph the rear hub made a pop sound and shifted to a higher gear. I checked the gear select switch while coasting to the edge of the road, but the selector moved freely, like the cable was not attached. Upon stopping and removing the plastic cover that the cable goes into, I found the little chain rod that slides into the hub axle had snapped off right at the threads that screw into the hub gear selection assembly. I put the chain part in my pocket as I could not see a way to get it back in without the threads on it. I figured it was probably in 2nd gear and could baby it home as there where only a few minor hills. After getting back on bike, the hub refused to spin freely. It was locked up. Couldn't even push the bike without picking up the rear end. After checking a few things and rolling in backwards a bit, it finally freed up forward spin. Not wanting a bad accident on way home, I turned off bbshd and started human power mode. 1/2 mile with no issue, and getting close to an intersection, I turned it back on in case I needed the power to escape a car. Pas was at 0. Sure enough a car not looking barrels around the corner blowing the stop sign and headed straight at me. So throttle was used, and the bike lurched forward with more power than I have ever felt on this or my previous bike. Made it home without any more issues, but I have questions. Why did the gear rod thingy snap? How do I fix it(part of rod with threads still inside)? Why is the torque so much higher now? What gear does that IGH default to without the gear selector? Should I swap the 3 spd for the 5? If so are the hub frames the same size(or not needing diff size spokes)?

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                      While looking at hubs online I see the 5 speed version (xl-rd5)is like the 3 speed version(XL-RD3) where the middle gear is straight thru 100% and 25% up/down per shift. But the x-rd8(70mm drum instead of xl 90mm drum) is different. It starts 1st gear as straight thru with plus 30% then plus 14% per gear. I am wondering what that additional top end would be. The XL-RD3 has overall gear range of 177%. 75, 100, 133. The X-RD8 is 325% 100, 133, 148, 169, 192, 220, 250, 325! Since I usually stay in 2nd unless I want to go fast, this seems like it may be what I. Looking for. It would suck to find a big hill tho. Anyone care to chime in?

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                        Opened up the rear hub that is having issues(XL-RD3). Found the axle key had shifted and caused internal damage. It is such a tiny little part that it slipped out of its place and got bounced around inside. I guess this is why the hub was locked then unlocked by pushing bike fwd/ back a few inches. The damage looks pretty bad. The axle key has a short edge with nicks and wear. The internals of the hub also look to have sustained damage from that part skipping around inside. After careful look and some thought, I think I am just going to buy a new hub, as the parts to make this one good is not that much less than a new one. And since I am going to replace it, why not check out an upgrade? I think I will be going ahead with the XR-RD8. It is only a 70mm drum brake but the current hub with a 90mm really does not give much more than a drag brake any way so not much of a downgrade there. What DOES get my attention tho are the fact the new "R" designation on some models refers to the shifting mechanism. This one does not use the chain indicator part that started all this mess. The new models use a "rotary" selection mechanism. It looks MUCH more robust, and a BREEZE to adjust/ set up. On top of that this being an 8 speed model versus my current 3 speed, the gear range is massively greater. 177% vs 325%. But the big help come from HOW the range is different not just higher. With the 3spd 2nd is straight thru 100% and first is -25% with 3rd being +33%. So I stayed in 2nd unless I was going up a BIG hill i would switch to 1 which I rarely ever did. I did use 3rd a lot to keep up with traffic once 2nd gear was topped out. But this 8spd starts the 100% at 1st gear and increases each gear up to 325. So my plan is to swap out the rear cog yet again, this time to a 22 or 23 tooth and swap out the hub to this new 8spd. The much larger cog 13T now vs 22T should give me a LOT more torque and power for hills, yet allow me to start in 1st always and progress to my desired/ needed gear. More like car shifting than true bicycle shifting mentality. I prefer to always start with the gear that is 1:1 or 100% to minimize stress on the IGH. That SOUNDS good to me, but I have no way of determining what these gear ratio changes will do to my top end or hill climbing ability. I have contacted SJSCycles in the UK, a great company that actually does customer SERVICE about my XL-RD3 issue. They got back to me in less than 12 hours. Just wow. I will update when I hear what the end result is. This hub was only on the road for 3 months. SMH

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                          Seems these things just never are "finished". LOL. Got parts to repair S/A XL-RD3 IGH, and a 24T cog. Also will be replacing both chains with a much better quality one(or two actually). Swap out headlight relay. Prime, paint, and install new fenders. And do some testing. Once I know everything is back to proper order, I can start the 1st true "upgrade". My Phaserunner has arrived. I also received 2 new 72v 60amp continuous BMS units along with 60 Samsung 25r 18650 cells. I will be rebuilding both packs from 14s5p to 20s5p, and continue to run them in parallel. Not sure what current I will end up with, but this thing has SO many settings and things to adjust/ program, I may not get it all done in a day. Think I need to go start a thread hear for phaserunner settings for a bbshd. Lots to do.....

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                            Got the IGH repaired and is working properly again. Also removed the "homemade" chain tensioner I had on it, as the new larger rear cog does not slip like the smaller one did. I am guessing the addition teeth/ diameter there are more teeth to chain points of contact. MUCH better, and more torque too!! While I had the back end apart, I swapped out the dropout tensioner. I had to use the "eye" part that slides over the axle from one set, and the rear brace and bolt from a different set to get it how I wanted. Thankfully they are inexpensive parts. The new chains are much better as well, and look better. I still need to prime/paint/polish and install new fenders. I got sidetracked with the Phaserunner install.
                            Now, I need to rebuild my battery packs. I have Two(2) 52v 12.5ah Samsung Packs from Luna running in parallel. I bought 60 new Samsung 25R cells and 2 72v 60amp BMS's to rebuild them with, but have since been GIVEN SEVENTY(70) Panasonic MH12210 cells, and 20 Samsung 20Q's!!! I am drowning in 18650s! I have tested each cell and found one(1) to be not worth using. The rest all seem like new. Once I break down the two Luna packs I will have:
                            200 Samsung 25r
                            70 PanasonicMH12210
                            19 Samsung 20q
                            I know enough that there are major differences in these cells, and not all can handle the same currents/ discharge rates as another could. I am wondering what kind of pack I can build with these. I have returned the 2 BMS units as I do not know what voltage I am going to go with. Anybody know the highest voltage and current a BBSHD running off a PHASERUNNER can handle? Dont want to go to "breaking point", but something just shy of that. I do plan to build 2 packs with 60-70amp continuous BMS's and run them in parallel again(100-140amp continuous). It seems to keep the draw on individual cells lower, thereby keeping temps low. I like that. These cells are not cheap, anything to increase their lifespan is fine by me. Maybe even build these packs to a higher voltage KNOWING to charge them at 80 or 90% to get the voltage back down to BBSHD/ Phaserunner limits. I foresee needing better heatsinks for the BBSHD as well. I also moved all electronic components(except battery packs) to the rear/ narrow portion of the tank, freeing up the largest portions of the tank for the new packs. I think I will need every single cubic inch in the tank for these new beasts. It will add more weight, but I dont foresee using this bike without power.
                            Originally I wanted to keep it all LUNA parts, but was unable to secure permission for more than one(1) Ludi controller. I have people that want me to build and sell these bikes locally, so I could not waste time using a part I would not be able to reproduce for future builds. Sorry Luna. There are some benefits tho, field weakening and such. Have not had time to read up or play with the settings much yet. But sounds like I should be able to increase the voltage from 58.8 to at least 80, maybe more. Can not imagine what this would feel like with 80V at 80amps!! This is a street bike, not a rock climber! I just have to be responsible enough to not USE that power on the streets. Rely on the display and experience to approximate my wattage output as to not stand out and get pulled over. Being I already do 40mph on a daily basis without hassle, I should be ok.
                            So, lets hear some voltage and current levels for a Phaserunner fed BBSHD................

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                              I recently found out about this KMC Kool Knight chain (stock photo from google):Click image for larger version

Name:	
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ID:	92970 It has 112 links and it turned out I needed 116 for the Felt, so I had to order a second chain. Luckily I can use the rest of the second chain too, because I have a non electric build that takes around 100 links only (smaller chainring and rear cog). Not cheap though.
                              Last edited by toro1978; 09-06-2019, 12:45 AM.

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                                I have seen those, but wondered about strength and stretching. How's it holding up? They do look nice. I need 156 links....plus a half link. Lol

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                                • toro1978
                                  toro1978 commented
                                  Editing a comment
                                  This is half links only. I don't know about the quality, but it is for BMX and single speed, so it should be ok. I have actually never seen or even heard of a torn chain. I had a "stretched" one on an very old bike and it was practically black from rust and grime.
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