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**paxtana** · 10-26-2017, 03:34 AM

I go thumb throttle as it's more predictable. If I lose control of the bike I'm a lot less likely to accidentally add more throttle if using a thumb throttle compared to a twist.

**Tommycat** · 10-30-2017, 02:07 PM

As you can see from the post's title. Some components have been chosen, though not all set in stone...yet.

Decided on the Magic Pie V5, as it appears to be the most powerful. Not requiring pedal assist. Also comes in a kit. Well supported by Luna Cycle.
The battery is a direct result of choosing the M.P.5. Again looking for max power output, and in my opinion best looks. Picked the Bottle Pack by Luna. 52volts-11.5 AH... I feel that it should be good for 20 miles. (at least)

So let's start with these...

**paxtana** · 10-31-2017, 12:48 PM

For what it's worth if you do run into some situation where you need longer range, the magic pie controllers are fully programmable with a golden motor program cable. This would allow you to lower the current output and considerably extend your range in exchange for reduced torque.

**Tommycat** · 11-01-2017, 11:06 AM

I started here with my first purchase...Luna's beautiful 52volt-11.5ah Bottle battery pack!

Why start here?

I wanted it to absolutely, perfectly, and with no doubt fit neatly into the bike's frame. So with it in my hot little paws, I can take it directly to the bike store to fit it directly!

The good... Got things going! I like the shape, quality, and features. Especially like the BMS cut-off with it's own side mounted switch!

The bad...As you might have noticed, it does not look like the advertisement pictures...

Contacted Luna about this discrepancy and was told that the silver case is no longer available. And they would be unable to supply it. I requested that they kindly update their advertising on it's web page so as to not disappoint more buyers, but as of today it's still being misrepresented. So heads up! When in doubt it looks like a phone call would be good insurance. Back from the future. Corrected by Pax...see below

Also the batteries power pigtail had wiring exposed to possible rubbing problems. Very minor. Easily fixed with a flexible loop inside the holder end. Lots of spare room. UPDATE: This was addressed later as I installed a Solid State Relay in the roomy case base.
Jump to Post # 23...

The Ugly... Shipping problems! Three delivery dates needed which required me to stay home and wait so I could sign for the Hazmat battery package, two being messed up.
Incorrect Hazmat documentation, messed up tracking codes were determined to be the source of the glitches... But finally after a three week delay it arrived safe and sound. Very well packed and awaiting my next steps...

Question for today... What is this connector...and will the mate be provided with the MPv5 Kit? Back from the future...Answered by Pax and Max below...

**paxtana** · 11-01-2017, 12:13 PM

Thanks for the heads up, we had it modified for the 48 but not 52. Pics are fixed.

That's an Anderson connector, you'll want to cut it off for hardwiring or using an xt90-s pigtails set. Only bbsxx are plug and play, golden motors come with bare wires off the motor as described in the hardcase documentation.

Luna hardcase battery documentation - Electricbike.com Ebike Forum

http://electricbike.com/forum/forum/knowledge-base/batteries-aa/12542-luna-hardcase-batteries-basic-faq

<td style="background-color:MediumSeaGreen"> Luna Hardcase Battery Documentation ESSENTIAL READING FOR NEW EBIKERS: Charging brand new batteries (https://electricbike.com/forum/forum/knowledge-base/batteries-aa/20988-charging-brand-new-batteries) Beginners guide to using your

There's a lot of wiring info there, as well as best practices for the pack such as strap reinforcement and regularly checking contacts, dielectric grease etc. Highly recommended reading.

**Tommycat** · 11-02-2017, 12:52 PM

Alright, time to choose a bicycle for the build!

My buyer's notes...

1) Battery must fit.
2) Shimano freewheel. (save money having to buy one that fits the Pie...)
3) Steel frame. (to take the torque)
4) 135mm drop-out. (So the Pie fits)
5) Wider tires.
6) Good rims.
7) Disc brakes.
8) Suspension.
9) Fenders.
10) Big soft seat.
11) Nice color.
12) Must fit both myself, (6') and wife 5'6"...

Take the battery in it's holder, tape measure, ruler and magnet with me to the store... and this is what I came away with.

Ahhhhh, the Huffy Parkside! 27.5 wheels. Linear pull caliper brakes. Seven speed. Fits well. Great cruising position. 1.75" tires. Good looking. 135mm drop-out.(nice surprise) Steel frame.
Didn't get everything I was looking for. But to me this was an acceptable compromise.

Let's get to mounting the battery!

**paxtana** · 11-02-2017, 04:49 PM

For that bike since it doesn't have disc brakes I would HIGHLY recommend using Kool-stop ebike brake pads. The MP5 can hit around 35mph with is really damn fast on a bicycle, and those pads were not built for it.

**Tommycat** · 11-03-2017, 01:24 PM

So knowing that the battery pack will physically fit on the frame. Time to make it happen.

First issue. The frames bottle mounting studs stick up above the tubing. And the bottom of the battery holder is flush. Also the studs are too low on the frame to align with the holder openings.

Studs sitting to tall...

Couldn't file them down as they are attached to the frame with welds at the top collar so...decided to move the holes on the holder, and grind out with a Dremal so it'll fit.

O.K. after all is said and done, it might have been cleaner to just drill a correct size partial hole so the collar would fit. But this worked...

Added third hole towards the top for extra secureness. Used a self tap sheet metal screw with rubber washer. Sealing with silicone caulk to prevent corrosion.

Yes! It is a snug fit!

Changed the top self tap screw to a Rivnut.
See about the extra Rivnut installation in post # 27... Short Cut.

More information here. https://electricbike.com/forum/forum...re-you-need-it

**Tommycat** · 11-11-2017, 01:22 PM

Golden Pie is on it's way! Got time for a motor-less first ride shake-down cruse.

Every thing looked great from the store. Good alignment, good brake action, everything appearing secure. Re-torqued the wheel nuts and went for a couple rides.

So after a couple miles, returned nursing a loose handle bar. Re-positioned and tightened. Found and secured a loose seat lock.
Found a resistance on the drive train.Troubleshot and found the bottom bearing assembly too tight and binding the bearings. Loosened up at tad. Much better.
Found resistance in the front wheel bearings.They also appear too tight and binding, loosened until freewheeling.
Got the dreaded front brake squeal! Yikes a nasty one. Wouldn't need a bell with that racket...Made a few pad adjustments but just can't seem to get rid of it. Will clean the rim and pads well, then try to toe it in a bit if needed...
Tweaked a spoke or two in the front wheel for trueness and adjusted the brakes.
Didn't bother with the gearing as I'm sure it will probably change with the hub motor installation.

Lessons learned...

Tighten EVERYTHING to specs. Things will stretch, loosen up, and settle in with use. Looks like minor adjustments may be required until broke in.

Question for the day... What display(s) do you use to keep track of speed, battery charge, and power draw?

**Tommycat** · 11-19-2017, 11:50 AM

Magic Pie V5 has arrived! No issues with shipping this time. :-) I'd just recommend using something a bit more substantial than plastic bubble wrap to support a 20 lb. motor...(hole in the bottom of cardboard box, shaft threads scraped.
A neat idea I've seen used is to secure the heavy object with plastic filled with foam from a can. NOTE: NOT EXPANSION Type! :-) Fills up the voids, secures the load once cured...

So my idea was to keep the existing rim so that I have a nice match. Tires and rims.(yep...looks) The downside, more work and the need for custom spokes. Also it's a single rim of aluminum alloy. Will it take the strain?

Here's where I started.

Checked the Pie out...REALLY NEAT! I was a bit surprised at the spinning resistance with no power supplied. A bit of auto braking which I'll look into later. Love the cruise function. More on it later.

So to get going I fabricated this handy nipple remover drill bit from a standard screw driver bit.

Loosen the nipples by hand a bit, well you know with a spoke wrench... and then finish with the driver.

CAUTION! As with all power tools care should be taken to not to go too quickly and let the bit slip out of the nipple head! Especially being in such close proximity to very soft aluminum. No need to ask me how I know. :-(

So removed the existing spokes and hub. I think I may regret not taking off the freewheel first, but my removal tool hasn't arrived yet.

This is where I had to laugh and ask myself..."what did you get yourself into!"

Time to measure up for new spokes. After reading up on the subject quite a bit... and using a slick calculator found HERE.
I came up with a spoke length of 138 mm.

Here are my inputs.

If you see an issue please let me know! May use the old spokes cut down to verify...to be continued.

**Tommycat** · 11-26-2017, 04:32 PM

Yep, found a mistake in my calculations...The hub hole diameters are 3mm not 2. Changed. Also added a little more Dishing offset as the 7 gear freewheel pushes the hub a little more over.

But I'd already cut the spokes down to 138mm. Gave them a try. Yep...just a tad long in a couple spots. Will go 137mm for the final custom cut spokes. But where did I get the trial set you ask?

**Tommycat** · 11-28-2017, 07:48 AM

Why from the original wheel spokes of course.

So my thoughts where to re-use the bikes original spokes to get the absolute correct length, and if they worked real well, to use for a bit. Now, not having a spoke thread roller, which would be really nice and easy. I decided to try and re-make the J-ends.

Fire and a hammer are both available to me. So I fabricated a holding die and fired up the torch...

Ahhhhh Forged in Fire! After a few experiments got fairly good results such as this...

...and after figuring in the required extra length for the mash and bend, cut em to length. Of course the first one I forgot to add the extra...grrrrrr. and one didn't come out well enough. So picked up two replacements from a local bike shop, and pressed on. (also got a quote for a set of 38 (36 plus 2 spares) custom cut Sapin Strong, black, J ended spokes).

Having received my freewheel tool in the mail, removed the freewheel from the original hub. Yep it was a little harder without the spokes and wheel to hang on to. But with a pull of the electric impact wrench trigger...off she came. Putting it on the Pie was fine. Tried to re-use the plastic chain guard, but just took up extra space, and didn't look that great. The 7 gear freewheel stuck out past the unthreaded part of the axel a tad, so had to add some spacing washers.

So lacing up the wheel all went well. Some discrepancies in the quality of the final lengths. And stripped a nipple. But got it done.

After all is said and done, I would not recommend this route to anybody...lol. With the correct spoke calculator inputs the recommended length(s) appear to be right on. And while stretching the spokes during truing heard the dreaded sporangggg of a popped j head. But re-did and re- installed ( a little shorter ) but back in business. Let you know how long they last...

**Tommycat** · 12-05-2017, 04:46 PM

So...with the battery mounted, motor laced in, and one, perhaps two good wheels...what's a cat to do? Go for a RIDE! Can't stand it any longer.

Wire nutted the battery wires together. Installed one universal rear torque arm, cruise control, twist throttle, and front brake lever. Holding the wiring harness to the frame with black tape. And away we go.

Started very slow and easy. Not going to be too demanding on the rear spokes till I get a few miles and a little bit of confidence in them.

First trip, road a couple blocks and up and down my rather steep driveway.

Very happy and a impressed with this set-ups performance. Being my first E-bike I don't have anything to compare it too except my 1965 Honda Trail 55 motorcycle. But I would say it may be just a bit quicker, and seemingly more torque than the Honda. The Honda's motor is 5 horse power, 54cc, but much heavier.

Checked the rear's spoke tensioning, tightening a couple. And added this electrical monitor to keep an eye on things as Luna has not yet re-stocked the BAC-601 LCD panel display. This is a Bayite DC 6.5-100V 0-100A LCD Display.

Second ride, about a mile around the park bike trail. Voltages good, hardly even taxing the battery. More smiles. Love the cruise control. Re-checked spoke tension...good.

Third ride, couple miles, bike trail, city roads, and a couple times around the house. Yep really trying to tax the spokes a bit on the rough grass. Yep Pax you are right. When things start to get a bit bouncy, that full twist throttle is difficult to stay even! Will try to tone the response down a bit when I get into programming. And perhaps try to mod the throttle a bit to add mass. Other thoughts...

The good...Meeting and exceeding my expectations of a 1500 watt, 52volt system. Fire forged spokes holding up well. Rides well, solid and stable.

The bad... Taped up wiring will be addressed. On rear wheel tear down, found even a very well torqued down axle moving (rocking) in the drop-out. Nowhere for the 7-speed rear freewheel shifter to go...like I even need it. ;-) And I've got to get some sort of suspension or better seat going.

The ugly... Yikes, haven't got the front caliper brakes to quiet down after cleaning the rim and brake pads. Will try toe-in next.

**Robert62** · 12-05-2017, 05:27 PM

I can't tell exactly what you did with the rear dropout but I strongly recommend torque arms on both sides and lock washer if you can fit them. I used something like this:

I also inspect my axle before every ride. These motors put massive torque on the axle and any repetitive motion can loosen the nuts. The torque arms double as a wheel retention device if the axle tries to "walk out" of the dropout slot.

Robert

Announcement

1st Build & E-Bike rider-Magic Pie V5 (rear) -Bottle Batt. 52v*11.5ah-Huffy Parkside

1st Build & E-Bike rider-Magic Pie V5 (rear) -Bottle Batt. 52v*11.5ah-Huffy Parkside

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