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1st Build & E-Bike rider-Magic Pie V5 (rear) -Bottle Batt. 52v*11.5ah-Huffy Parkside

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  • Tommycat
    replied
    Houston, we have a problem! After inviting some friends to try my E-Bike for their first time E-Bike ride. A huge problem with the full twist throttle arose as it was difficult for a new rider to NOT pull the throttle back when applying the rear brakes! Yikes. As you know the braking will disable the motor, but upon release of the brake allows the motor immediately to power up. Causing a bit of panic, and erratic start/stop jerking. NOT GOOD!

    And as someone who is quite familiar with it's operation, there are some issues I noticed also...


    Such as going over rough terrain and having the throttle bounce around and cause erratic motor speed operation.

    Much to easy to accidently "bump" off of cruise control.

    And not being able to really relax, rest, or lean on the throttle side of the handle bars.


    As you know, the thumb throttle was highly recommended at the start of my build. I might just end up there.....errrr but not quite yet. :-)

    At the time I'd never even heard of a half twist throttle, but now it looked like something to try before bailing out and buying a new thumb throttle.


    Original full length twist throttle...





    Figuring cut line and starting the hacksaw cut...





    Too late to go back now...





    Final product...





    And the results are in! Better control over rough terrain! Better control on typical ride, easy to set and maintain cruise setting! And rest and relaxation on the secure grip part.
    Now if I can get my test pilots back to give it a try! :-O

    And the bonus? Easy access to unlock the tabs allowing entry to the internal wiring! :-)
    Last edited by Tommycat; 09-06-2018, 01:16 PM.

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  • Rider
    commented on 's reply
    Good point...

  • Tommycat
    commented on 's reply
    @Rider...I've used the fan belt spray for it's intended purpose. To keep the belt FROM SLIPPING. It's tacky and sticky, and I'm afraid it would not be good to use for braking.
    As there is some slippage needed for typical operation.

    @commuter ebikes...Got some excellent tips for disk brake squeal before I pointed out I have RIM brakes. Take a look at the end of this thread! HERE!

  • commuter ebikes
    commented on 's reply
    I have disk brakes and they squeal when I ride in the rain. I find this annoying.

  • Rider
    commented on 's reply
    Yikes! First thing that came to mind was fan belt squeak spray. Don't have any idea if it might work or how it will affect braking, but it is made to stop belt squeaking and not allow the belt to slip...

  • Tommycat
    replied
    Been fighting with a front wheel "SQEEEEEEEEL" issue forever. Reached out to the forum community. See thread here...

    Tried cleaning the rim with cleaner and alcohol, sanding the brake pads, tightening the front bearings, tightening the front spokes, truing the front rim, adjusting the pads, switching the pads from side to side, clean the rim again with soft scrub, toe-in the pads, sanding the rim connection point smooth, corrected adjustment cone installation, tried eliminating caliper arm play, cleaned the rims with steel wool and car rubbing compound, bought and installed new pads... you get the picture? Did I mention I cleaned the rims? ;-)













    After all that this is what I got...




    No Joy.

    Taking a step back and thinking it over. It just seemed that the pads where gripping and sticking just a little too well. I mean they stopped you on a dime...but that noise. Arrrrrgggg.

    So as a last ditch effort I gave it the only solution I could come up with...baby powder! Yep, bit on the pads and rim, ahhhhhh, smooth as silk, no noise! I did lose a bit of braking. But not enough to concern me. And I'm stopping very well. I'll see how long this lasts...


    Another issue bites the dust. :-)
    Last edited by Tommycat; 04-23-2018, 03:56 PM. Reason: corrected video link...

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  • Tommycat
    replied
    Time for something that I've been waiting and looking forward to for quite a long time. To communicate with my Magic Pie v5 Vector controller! A shout out to Gary Salo and Golden Motor Canada for supporting the Pie with stocking a communication USB cable. And straight forward sales and shipping. Well done. So with cable and laptop in hand, time to get it set up...

    After downloading the latest communication software and driver installation program from Gary's web site to the laptop. Plugged in the communication cable from a spare USB port to the Pie's 5 wire communications port. (also used for the Smart Panel Display and Bluetooth dongle. But only one at a time...;-)








    New hardware was recognized.





    Decided to see if the old Vista operating system had what it takes to find and install the driver. So choose Locate and Install...





    errrr....nope. Never hurts to try. So I let the driver installation program do it's thing...





    Ahhhhh success! Verified which COM port was used thru Device Manager...





    ...Com 4
    Started the communication software which I had installed earlier. And changed the access port from 3 to 4...





    Turned on power to the controller and then hit the Connect button which is just left of the Com selection window.





    Connection established! Neat. But ran into a glitch. Wanting to save the original configuration to an exported file, tried to do just that...





    But got this error...





    Since this was the first and only time I received this error after successfully exporting some changed settings to my hard drive, I'm going to give it a pass.

    The software displays only those parameters that the controller supports. In the case of the Pie, just 12 are supported.





    My changes so far are as follows

    Kept Regenerative or E-Braking Enabled. I really like this feature as helps to brake the bike, and puts a little juice in the tank at the same time.(very little, lol and only works if the battery is depleted a bit...) O.K. this isn't a change...But I like E-Braking. :-)

    I disabled Reverse operation. 1) not needed. 2) eliminates the danger if reverse control wire is accidently made.

    Set Battery drawn current to 18 amps to satisfy E-bike regulations.

    Set maximum forward speed to 250 RPM, again to satisfy regulations.

    That's all right now, but may decrease the E-Braking to 40 or 45. As it is quite aggressive at this time.

    Click download button...and all set.


    So far these changes have effected the bikes operation in what I'd call a positive manner. Starting from a stop is smoother. Changes in throttle position has less abrupt changes in speed.
    It regulates maximum speed to 20 MPH. And uses less battery power to do it!

    Very pleased...
    Last edited by Tommycat; 04-18-2018, 01:34 PM.

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  • Tommycat
    replied
    Originally posted by Tommycat View Post




    And that did the trick! Absolutely no slipping issue, so it can be done! So with renewed faith that it can be over come even with a worn cog and chain. I'm planning my next attack.


    As there doesn't appear to be any other adjustments. Thinking that rotating the D-hanger counter clockwise to get the assembly as close to the torque arm (and teeth) as possible to grab as many teeth as possible.


    And removing a couple links to increase chain tension.


    Always mindful of course that it must be able to spool up to the low gear cogs just as well, without the idler gear hitting the cogs. Master links on order, will tear down derailleur looking for adjustment screws...


    Can it be done?

    Since this is a new bike and assembly, and being able to eliminate the issue at least temporarily with the existing parts. My course was set to reproduce the fix by adjustments rather than remove and replace.


    And the answer is...


    With new parts in hand... well O.K. A new master link, but there are 5 in the bag. ;-) I started the final push!


    Please refer to this picture for actions taken...




    #1 First action taken... verify correct chain length. Using the largest chain ring to largest cog and add 2 pins method. Found that my chain was 2 links too long--- corrected.



    Results... no change.

    #2 Notched the derailleur hanger around the axle to allow it to rotate counter-clockwise. Letting the gear pulley to get closer to the cogs. See top picture item #3 and the next picture.




    Results... no change.

    #4 Gear pulley still looked to be riding too high off the cog. So it was either decrease spring tension at the hanger pivot, or increase spring tension at the #4 pivot point.

    As the chain was still a bit slack, I increased the spring tension at #4 pivot. Now not having any adjustment options this was done by drilling out a new spring attachment point in the end housing to make it a quarter turn tighter.




    Results... Torque arm was interfering a bit. So had to go to #5...

    #5 Removed a quarter inch of material off the torque arm to eliminate interference with derailleur gear operation.

    Results...Pay dirt! Absolutely no popping, skipping, skating, or slippage at the cog, whats so ever! Even under the most aggressive power stroke I can muster. :-P

    Here is a shot of the changes made...




    You can see the better chain angle engaging more cog teeth, and with better chain tension, all is well.

    Did the change from a 10mm round axle to a 14mm flat on 2 sides axle cause the issue? Which changed the over-all position of the derailleur gears? Bad cog spacer? Extra mass of the back wheel? Too long of chain contributing?
    Cheap/// errr inexpensive donor bike (parts)? We'll see if this lasts...


    One happy cat...
    .







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  • Tommycat
    replied
    While waiting on some parts, got in a little customizing work... The bikes name comes from not a Saturn V, but a little smart mouthed, genetically engineered raccoon... :-) But the V works! Cut out of self stick vinyl. Rocket freehand, lettering on a borrowed Cricut machine. 2-D cutting is neat. I can see why people go for the 3-D machines.


    Model...




    Two toned...






    Version 1...






    Rats, me thinks a little too big...





    Version 2...








    Ahhhhh...sticking with that one!

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  • commuter ebikes
    commented on 's reply
    I still think that when this happens you should substitute in new parts one by one until you isolate the problem, taking advantage of how inexpensive bicycle parts are.

    As instructive, fun and interesting it may be to tear down and rebuild a freewheel or derailleur, you will save time by installing in a new part.

    I wonder what would happen if you substituted in a new freewheel, derailleur and properly tensioned chain all at once. A new derailleur, chain and freewheel would only set you back about $40 and you would have a nice little stockpile of spare parts for later.

  • Tommycat
    replied
    Been sidetracked trying to eliminate a drivetrain problem, non-electric type... Below are some details, to see the full thread and/or offer advice...please go HERE.

    In the highest gear, smallest sprocket, furthest away from the Magic Pie 5 hub motor. And under moderate to strong peddle input I will get what is best described as a "POP" and a quick 10 degree slippage down. Some times twice in quick succession. It happens on either leg driving the force. It seems to me that its coming from the rear freewheel/derailleur. But impossible for me to spot. No problems in any other gear. It's a 7 gear Shimano threaded on freewheel. Single chain ring in front. Twist shifter.

    Less than 10 miles ridden on it, most on electric power only. :-)
    Efforts to fix...
    Derailleur hanger alignment. Parallel with the freewheel gears.
    Derailleur adjustment, low, high, linear tracking.

    Checked chain for stuck links...all free. Lubricated
    Removal and disassembly of the freewheel hub assembly. Checking of the pawls, ratchets, shimming and general operation and relube. A slight touch of marine grade grease, and 20 weight non-detergent oil.
    Maximum/minimum derailleur gear positions...outside of recommendations.
    I can get everything to work smooth as silk, with perfect alignment, and shifting top to bottom. But the minute I put a bit of power into the downstroke...POP. Arrrggggg.
    In the interest of full disclosure, I seemed to have made it worse after the hub teardown and re-lube...
    Pictures of the terror...






    Inside of the freewheel hub...







    What I know... It's definitely slippage! Slippage is probably caused by worn gears, worn chain, not enough teeth engaged, or loose chain tension and typical derailleur alignment.


    So I decided to try to get rid of the problem first, before investing in parts.


    This is where I started...with the original set-up, and good adjustments. Note the engagement of teeth with the idler gear quite high off the cog, 6 or less teeth engaged...













    Still slipping... So went to the bungee tool box and grabbed and installed a tensioning tool to bring the idler down to engage more teeth...









    Still slipping...hummmm but not as much! So with teeth engagement taken care of...added another tensioning adjuster to tighten up the chain a bit...









    m
    And that did the trick! Absolutely no slipping issue, so it can be done! So with renewed faith that it can be over come even with a worn cog and chain. I'm planning my next attack.


    As there doesn't appear to be any other adjustments. Thinking that rotating the D-hanger counter clockwise to get the assembly as close to the torque arm (and teeth) as possible to grab as many teeth as possible.


    And removing a couple links to increase chain tension.


    Always mindful of course that it must be able to spool up to the low gear cogs just as well, without the idler gear hitting the cogs. Master links on order, will tear down derailleur looking for adjustment screws...


    Can it be done?

    After a slight intermission... see the solution in POST #36 below...
    Last edited by Tommycat; 03-09-2021, 03:45 PM.

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  • Rider
    commented on 's reply
    Very nice!

  • Tommycat
    replied
    While trying to get the throttle LED charge indicator lights to be more accurate. And actively pursuing a low voltage indicator light that would be a blinking red LED. Into the electronics field we go.
    Checked out and read the book "Electronics For Dummies". Ordered an electronics starter kit. And started experimenting! Found circuits online for "blinking LEDS". Backwards transistor, two transistor, and 555 timer type. Learned a lot, but nothing seemed tough enough to use, or worked perfectly/accurately. So I went online and found some LEDs that blinked all by themselves! But not only that, would change color from red to blue! Nice. They are rated at 12 volts, and will consume your typical 20mA current. But after finding that my installed Bayite LCD digital current/voltage display has a setting that will blink the display at under and over voltage set points. It rendered my blinking alarm light a bit mute...

    So what to do with some store bought blinking LEDs?

    Decided to upgrade my reflectors! Anything to improve being seen has to be good.


    Showing an LED installed and the LED in a RED blink.




    Part modifications and the LED in Blue blink mode.





    Potted in silicone.





    Added translucent covers. (plastic milk carton)





    Wired 4 in series to main battery voltage, with an inline fuse who's circuit also provides power to the Bayite. Double checked current with battery at 58 volts...draws a bit over 20mA. Nice and bright!

    Errrrr, sorry about the muddy back tire...





    And here is the result...




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  • Tommycat
    replied
    For comfort went with a wider and softer saddle... Schwinn quilted cruiser saddle. Painless install, good fit. After a couple adjustments it seems to work well.






    Considering a thudbuster, but with it's cost about the same as my whole new bike donor it's hard to do.





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  • Tommycat
    replied
    Originally posted by Tommycat View Post
    Wanted to get access to the full twist throttle wiring for a couple mods.

    So as you can see from my last post it was necessary to get into the throttle assembly to tweak the LED power display.

    My other thought after doing a couple burn-outs and running over my foot once while working on the bike "hot". Was to be able to disable the twist throttle as desired. I accomplished this by using the latch 'on' switch on the throttle assembly, which is originally wired to power the lights on. Removed those wires and put it in series with the throttle 5 volt supply power. Now if I can just remember to disable it when done riding.:-) Considered perhaps using a pressure switch on the seat... but lifting off the seat for maximum pedal power would defeat that... just not sure.

    EDIT: This switch has worked well for me, especially while trying different throttle modifications. See my hall sensor thottle thread... It's a keeper.
    Last edited by Tommycat; 08-26-2018, 08:57 AM.

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