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    #16
    My prayers are with you. I use ebrake on the front but never thought of a kill switch. I have the BBSHD and will figure something off the gear interrupter plug.

    Comment


    • calfee20
      calfee20 commented
      Editing a comment
      The BBSHD has the combo switch that would allow you to mash down on the power button and a max of 30 amps, non ludicris. I was probably doing a minimum of 70 amps @ 80 volts. I just started working on it again today.

    • xcnick
      xcnick commented
      Editing a comment
      Getting back on the horse as the saying goes? If you are going to do things like this, you have got to get it on video.

    #17

    The TDCM doesn't have any kind of a hole shot but that may be because of the phaserunner. I won't know until I try a different controller. That won't happen anytime soon because I really like the way this trike runs right now. Once you are going a couple of mph the motor is quite responsive and will pull me up hills with the throttle alone. Bear in mind I live in the flatlands and had to go looking for hills. The ones I did find most people probably would laugh at.


    The 5 speed works great. I have the PAS set up for 1500 watts in 10 steps and just leave it at 500 watts. This trike is a coasting machine. Just start off in 1st and the motor kicks in within a quarter turn of the pedals and you are off with 500 watts which seems to be all this needs. It seems all you need are 1st and 4th or fifth. Once you get started it pulls fine in any gear.

    I have let a few people ride some of my bikes and for for a new "older" rider the initial hit of a few hundred watts or more can be a little startling. This rig doesn't do that. It just smoothly takes off will bring you right up to twenty plus. I haven't gone faster yet. The trike is very stable but the slightest touch can have you in a different lane. I am going to install a steering damper and see if this will help.

    The motor typically runs around 60 degrees C but a few hills and a lot throttle has seen 70 but not 80 yet. This motor has stator aid according to grin and I don't think any senible riding would overheat it. There is an odd very soft grunting noise on starts but then it is totally silent. All I hear is tire noise. I can really sneak up on people on the bike paths, dogs to.


    If anyone has any questions about this motor feel free to ask. There is very little info anywhere about it. This would be a great motor for just about any bike. The only draw back I see is the torque tab may make installation a little harder. Horizontal dropouts will be a plus here.

    Comment


    • BK Xray
      BK Xray commented
      Editing a comment
      So was the hole shot issue with the motor at the full 1500 watts or when you have it at 500? How is the gear spacing on the 5 speed? Does it feel like the steps between gears are about right?

    • calfee20
      calfee20 commented
      Editing a comment
      The gear spacing is fine. The motor pulls fine once you are rolling. Don't get me wrong it will go with just the throttle but it is the smallest DD hub I have and it feels a little weak on takeoff. If you have used a bbshd that has the throttle slaved to the pas level it is like taking off in pas 1 with the throttle. I am going out with it tomorrow I will try the 1500 watt pas. I will also try to map the throttle through the CA and see if I can improve the situation.

    #18
    Originally posted by calfee20 View Post
    The TDCM doesn't have any kind of a hole shot but that may be because of the phaserunner. I won't know until I try a different controller.

    I have let a few people ride some of my bikes and for for a new "older" rider the initial hit of a few hundred watts or more can be a little startling. This rig doesn't do that. It just smoothly takes off will bring you right up to twenty plus.

    There is an odd very soft grunting noise on starts but then it is totally silent. All I hear is tire noise. I can really sneak up on people on the bike paths, dogs to.
    Is that phaserunner programmable? The one that I looked at had great programmable set points that could possibly give you more get up and go and quiet the start. Also supports regenerative throttle which I find interesting.


    http://www.ebikes.ca/documents/PhaserunnerDraft.pdf


    Had to smile at the sound level at speed, as my Pie is similar and quite funny to see the rabbits wondering where 'that guy' came from?

    Sorry to hear about your accident and glad to see your back and on the mend! (and building :-)


    Best regards.
    T.C.

    See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

    Comment


      #19
      Ok for all of the speed freaks out there I guess saying 20 + doesn't cut it. I have a 14 amp/hr GA rectangle from Luna that was charged to 90%. I found a flat straight stretch with a slight down hill slope. I got up to 29.7 mph. The motor was in that slow uptick mode but I didn't see any reason to push it more. In the other direction, slight up hill I got to 27.9 mph. The cycle analyst recorded a max of 41 amps and a low voltage of 56.9 which I assume was on the uphill run. I suspect the 41 amps is about all you can expect from the Phaserunner.

      II think this video will describe the slow takeoff. Watch from three minutes on and pay attention to the speed readout on the screen. When he starts out there is a fraction of a second where the bike is slow to accelerate and then it takes off with a rush and then slowly increases speed again.




      This hub is like that. It doesn't take off with a jerk but it pulls good and it will give you a good rush of speed from about 10 to 25.

      Comment


      • paxtana
        paxtana commented
        Editing a comment
        The ASI controllers we programmed for Mac and Cyclone do the same thing, relatively slow initial ramp up compared to a standard trap controller that often just peaks all at once. I would assume it's just consistently an ASI thing since they made all these including phaserunner. Even the more powerful ASI version used on the Surron racing video, that had to be specifically tuned for a long time to get it to stop being so timid off the line.

      • calfee20
        calfee20 commented
        Editing a comment
        Thank you. You just explained a lot. I like the setup and I really don't need it to be any faster.

      #20
      Well after about 300 miles I have two complaints the side thrust developed in turns on the trike flexes the rear wheel enough to cause the rear brake disc to touch and sing. It doesn't have to be much of a turn either. The bicycle axle and bearings in the Sturmey-Archer hub don't seem to be up to the task. A two wheeler should be fine because everything stays in line when leaning in turns. The slow start off is of course another.

      I took my Edge 1500 off of the fat rim it was laced to and put it on a 24 inch nova rim.

      Click image for larger version

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      I tried a cross 1 pattern but I got spoke bending at the nipples so I switched to this radial pattern. I started out by cutting and rethreading some Sapim strong 13/12 ga butted spokes but when I decided to go with the radial pattern I switched to some straight 13 ga spokes that commuter ebikes gave me.

      I have been threading the spokes with this rig.

      Click image for larger version

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      There is a substantial learning curve to get the threads correct. Greenwerks just got one of these and we spent 3 hours on the phone while we were fiddling around and trying different things to get our threaders to work. I wouldn't want to try to make a living with one of these but if you want to repurpose a few sets of spokes it will pay for itself.

      The wheel should go on fairly easy but it seems we are rapidly running out of weather so I don't know when I will get to test it. Well I have to get back to work on the floor of my RV...……..calfee

      Comment


        #21
        Well the trike is totally rebuilt. I laced up two new front wheels using Nova rims. I went with an odd spoke pattern because of an article I read somewhere. It seems a radial pattern is stronger for side loading that a trike will receive. I used a cross 3 pattern with Sapim strong spokes on the inside, and a radial pattern on the outside with those 13 ga spokes commuterebikes gave me.

        I don't know if you will be able to see the patterns but here is a photo.

        Click image for larger version

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        The changes to the trike include new rims all around. New motor, controller, throttle, 60 tooth chain wheel, 140mm crank arms and a 12-26 freewheel. The handlebars got moved up and forward a little "great change for me" I also pulled out the 52 volt slimline battery and rack and swapped in a new Topeak rack. I have also gone to 72 volts with a pair of these Luna batteries. http://lunacycle.com/72v-panasonic-pf-11-6ah/ Based on past performance I should have a t least a 75 mile range, if I can keep my foot out of the accelerator so to speak.

        Finally a finished photo.

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        Every change I made has had a positive impact on the rideability of the trike and I plan on reprograming the controller when I get to Florida. 8000 watts once in a while should be fun...……….calfee

        Comment


          #22
          I went on a 30 mile ride today and I was taking it easy. Pedal assist 500 watts, max speed 23 mph and average speed was around 12. I was getting 16 watts per mile. This will give me a range of over 100 miles.

          Comment


            #23
            Never ridden a trike like that. Looks like fun. What’s it feel like going in the mid 20’s? I read 8000W and got shivers! Great range.
            MOVING BACK TO PEDAL...
            2020 Banshee Paradox V3 Drop Bar 1x11
            2018 Soma Wolverine 3spd IGH Belt Drive
            2018 Surly ECR 1x7
            1991 Schwinn Crosspoint 7spd (BBS02B)

            Comment


              #24
              Originally posted by Rider View Post
              Never ridden a trike like that. Looks like fun. What’s it feel like going in the mid 20’s? I read 8000W and got shivers! Great range.
              Once you get around 25 it gets a little "twitchy". You have to ride it with a light hand because the smallest input will corner it right now. When you pedal with PAS the trike will slightly rock or weave with your pedaling motion. I installed a 60 tooth chain wheel and a 12-26 7spd freewheel to combat this problem. I am also running 140 mm crank arms. The slower cadence allows me to pedal up to about 25 and maintain a decent line.

              I have no idea how the controller is setup. I got on it once with the 3spd switch in high and was going to fast like right away. I glanced down after I let the throttle go and I was going more than 30. There are guys out there who go more than 50 on these but not me.

              That one time was around 5000 watts and only one battery was connected. I have since connected two in parallel so 100 amps is easily doable. What for I don't know. The Suncoast bike trail down here North of Tampa would be just the place to try it though.

              Speed runs are throttle only and straight of course!

              Comment


                #25
                I went on a 42 mile run today. I was got 16.8 watts to the mile. I kicked the PAS up to 700 watts and was doing around 24 on the way back. I was quite surprised that the efficiency was still so good.

                My regenerative braking is working on this new controller and I didn't realize it until one of my axle nuts loosened up. I will have to pay attention next time I go out.
                Last edited by calfee20; 01-11-2019, 05:15 PM.

                Comment


                • Rider
                  Rider commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Can you drill and wire the nut or get a slotted nut and drill the axle?

                • calfee20
                  calfee20 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I tightened the heck out of it. The problem with regen is the axle will rock back and forth between acceleration and braking. I have a torque arm on it but it was just there to protect the dropouts during acceleration I wasn't planning on the regen but it was turned on in this new 18 fet controller. What I need is a second torque arm to apply pressure in the opposite direction. That will have to wait until I get back home. I may have to go into the programing and turn off the regen but now that I have used it I like it.

                #26
                I spent a lot of time doing an alignment and I reinstalled the air shocks. The trike is rolling easier and it is quieter now. I reset the cycle analyst, shifted to a lower gear, pedaled a little harder, and used less wattage on the assist. Over the last four miles I was getting 12 watts per mile and averaged 15 mph. It was a little to slow though.

                Comment


                  #27
                  I got a new project coming. There are trikes all over the place down here and when I talked to the owners they all mentioned Bent Revolution. http://www.bentrevolution.com/ It was only 4 miles from Jay B Starkey park which is turning into a favorite ride so I went there. There is nothing like this in Mass so I got sucked in and bought a new trike. A Hp Velotechnik fs 26 frame kit. It has full suspension and a long wheelbase. It should be showing up about the time I get home in March.

                  Click image for larger version

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                  The frame kit has no wheels brakes or drive train. They want over $3000 for the electric drive so needless to say I will be putting my own together.

                  Comment


                  • BK Xray
                    BK Xray commented
                    Editing a comment
                    That is one quality trike! Are you going to go mid-drive or hub motor on this one?

                  • calfee20
                    calfee20 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Hub motor. I really like the stress free drive line that a hub motor gives you. However I have 3 different rear wheels that could bolt to that with my BBS02 and I could do that real quick.

                  #28
                  Wait a minute that isn't a KMX

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                  This is my new Hp Velotechnik Scorpion with full suspension. Happy Happy Joy Joy.

                  Comment


                    #29
                    I like this thread. It's hard for me to comment because I know nothing about hub motors or trikes. I wouldn't dare ride one in urban South Florida traffic, but it looks like huge fun.
                    I wonder if you could put mid drive in front of the rear wheel with 2 chainrings on it. One chained to the pedals 1:1 and a big one to the rear. Kind of like a tandem 2 chain setup. maybe an IGH hub.
                    Last edited by Retrorockit; 06-01-2019, 10:45 PM.

                    Comment


                      #30
                      Originally posted by Retrorockit View Post
                      I like this thread. It's hard for me to comment because I know nothing about hub motors or trikes. I wouldn't dare ride one in urban South Florida traffic, but it looks like huge fun.
                      I wonder if you could put mid drive in front of the rear wheel with 2 chainrings on it. One chained to the pedals 1:1 and a big one to the rear. Kind of like a tandem 2 chain setup. maybe an IGH hub.
                      That is an interesting thought. It would be easier to just put a BBSXX in the front bracket and use an IGH in the rear wheel.

                      I was just north of Tampa and found several great bike paths. I would scout them on my bike and if they were suitable then I would take my trike. I was just checking South Florida with http://ridewithgps.com/ and I found a few possibilities down there. I also see that there aren't nearly as many paths as the Tampa area.

                      Comment


                      • tklop
                        tklop commented
                        Editing a comment
                        Some of the recumbent setups to be seen in the photos at the Cyclone-TW website show an approach similar to what he's suggesting; where your motor isn't at your feet. Worth taking a look--there's a lot of neat ways to make the double-freewheels and other accesories work together.

                        [edited to add the link]

                        http://www.cyclone-tw.com/photo.html
                        Last edited by tklop; 06-03-2019, 10:16 AM.
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