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    Water Issue With Display Switch (Power Button & +/- Buttons)

    I was riding in wet snow a couple of days ago, and some snow must have landed on the switch, melted, and got inside.

    When I got home I shut off the display and everything seemed fine, but when I tried to turn it back on about 15 minutes later, the display appeared dead. PAS and throttle still worked though. I unplugged the switch and plugged it back in, at which point the display came on, but looked glitched. Throttle and PAS still worked.

    I have a spare display, so I plugged in my spare switch, and everything went back to functioning 100%. I haven't tested the old switch since - trying to let it dry out before I test it again to find out if it's toast. I actually think it'll be fine once it dries out.

    So, I'm wondering if anyone has had this problem, and how they dealt with it. I have two goals here:

    I want to waterproof this thing so this doesn't happen again

    Is this possible? How would I go about it? I used silicone to waterproof my display, but I'm not sure the same method will work with this switch.

    Is there a way I can override this switch so that I won't be stranded if this happens when I'm out somewhere?

    I've heard you can jumper some pins to bypass the display entirely. That would then bypass this switch, correct? How do you control when the bike is on/off without the switch? It would just always be on, perhaps?

    If this is possible, then I would carry the jumper with me in my emergency kit (I don't want to carry a spare switch with me). Or maybe it's not necessary, since it seemed like the bike still functioned even though the switch was not working properly. But it didn't seem healthy to try to operate the system with a switch that is compromised with water.
    Last edited by Gmullz; 02-03-2017, 08:01 AM.

    #2
    You don't say what switch and display. But generally it's pretty easy as long as you can disassemble it: Take the switch apart, find the paths that water can follow to the inside, apply sealant, reassemble.

    Or just stick a plastic baggie over it when it starts to rain.
    Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by JPLabs View Post
      You don't say what switch and display. But generally it's pretty easy as long as you can disassemble it: Take the switch apart, find the paths that water can follow to the inside, apply sealant, reassemble.

      Or just stick a plastic baggie over it when it starts to rain.
      Thanks! I'll give that a go.

      Comment


        #4
        I'm a food delivery courier so I work in the rain
        I had the same issue on my first rain day using the DPC-14 with the 3 button switch
        the display was glitching then stopped
        i used my multimeter to find the problem and check the continuity of the switch

        I removed it from the handlebars on the bottom I unscrewed the 4 tiny Phillips screws holding the plastic switch cover over a rubber gasket/switch cover underneath that is a small circuit board with 3 micro analog buttons held with 2 tiny Phillips screws

        i dried it under a fan and it was fine the next day I leveled the button on the handlebars wondering about the gasket that worked for a few more days then it went out again so I starred using a small piece of plastic and a rubber band

        It went out for good so I took it apart to examine it
        They use silicone to waterproof the button and the missed 2 pins 1 wire broke at the solder joint I changed the silicone and trimmed the wire I'm going to desolder reconnect and do a better job of waterproofing it
        i put in an order for the new display but what to do in the interim I hotwired the display
        ​​







        ​​​​​​
        Attached Files
        Last edited by Robert Larrison; 04-13-2017, 02:41 PM.

        Comment


        • JPLabs
          JPLabs commented
          Editing a comment
          Thanks for the reminder about how to hot wire. Pic sent to my phone, and I need to tuck a jumper wire in my kit someplace, just in case.

          As an emergency jumper wire source that's always with the bike, I think one could break a strand off the end of a shifter cable - the unused part that sticks out.

        #5
        Water resistance is going to one of those areas in which ebikes have a long way to go :( Not all that many people ride in wet conditions for very long. With that being said, there are five basics approaches:

        1. Replace open mechanical switches with enclosed solid state devices. We have made a lot of progress in that area as most of the variable resistor type throttles have been replace by throttles with hall effect sensors.

        2. Slop on the dielectric grease. This is by far the least scientific approach... but it can be the most effective. Almost all water related problems are because a drop of water is shorting out two conductors. Covering the conductors with dielectric grease which usually has the consistency of vaseline prevents the water from getting onto the electrical bits.

        3. Seal the enclosures. The third approach is to seal any opening in housing which would allow water to penetrate the housing. I am from Wisconsin where we salt our roads in the winter so I might be more extreme than most here :) I open each component which can be opened and run a thin bead of silicon wherever two halves of the enclosure come together. This includes displays, hardshell battery cases, and controller housings. Then I add a small dab of silicon wherever one or more wires penetrate an enclosure.

        4. Design for water resistance. Always try to make sure openings face downwards and all wires have drip loops before they pass through an enclosure. you want to avoid water gathering on a wire and traveling down the wire into the enclosure.

        5. Good old plastic bags. Whenever the weather is particularly nasty I wrap a clear plastic bag around the display.

        Comment


          #6
          Great advice as always.

          I opened a failed C961 display last week, to see if I should rework my new one to seal it better. I was impressed to find it was fully sealed already. Including the remote buttons. Now I wish I'd stuck it in a bucket of water for a while first. But it looked good to me, and was bone dry inside despite considerable rain/snow use over the last year.
          Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.

          Comment


            #7
            Originally posted by JPLabs View Post
            Great advice as always.

            I opened a failed C961 display last week, to see if I should rework my new one to seal it better. I was impressed to find it was fully sealed already. Including the remote buttons. Now I wish I'd stuck it in a bucket of water for a while first. But it looked good to me, and was bone dry inside despite considerable rain/snow use over the last year.
            I actually think the display is fairly waterproof. I had one hiccup in the rain when I first got my BBSHD, and I thought it was the display acting up, but now I think it may have been the remote buttons. I have ridden through every kind of precipitation known to man, at all levels of intensity, and my display has held up well. Even at that, the remote buttons have only acted up seriously once (the reason for posting this thread). I have yet to re-test my original set of remote buttons since posting this thread.

            Seeing this thread again has reminded me I should go through the process of trying to better seal my remote buttons.

            Comment


              #8
              Originally posted by Robert Larrison View Post
              I'm a food delivery courier so I work in the rain

              i put in an order for the new display but what to do in the interim I hotwired the display
              ​​

              ​​​​​​
              Thanks for this! I am going to store this picture somewhere safe. I'll have to add a wire to my emergency kit for situations like this.

              edit: Actually, I am reminded of this article: http://www.poweredride.com/info/dump...isplay-options

              This will bypass the display entirely. I may just go with this method for emergency purposes.
              Last edited by Gmullz; 04-21-2017, 02:58 AM.

              Comment


                #9
                It's the buttons
                i got the new display but it didn't work properly
                PAS levels worked and I was able to get to settings and programming but I was getting 'error code 30'and no speedometer signal was getting to display but I was getting signal to other display and battery reading was way off
                I checked connections and tested for signals with a multimeter

                I needed to work so I cut the 4 button switch to splice it to the working display
                The 750c is wired to the display it has 6 wires the 3 button switch has 5 so I opened the switch and traced the leads with the multimeter and connected it works fine except for battery voltage

                I learned a lot from the Poweredride Dump the display article
                I first tried using the programming cable to bypass the display but I don't have a computer to program it so it seemed to be starting in PAS 9 but when I did the same bypass to the display it would start in PAS 1 and when I would hit the 15%+ grade San Francisco hills I'd gear down and hit the throttle

                before I spiced i made one test of the older display connected with the switch bypassed
                I ran a jumper from connection #3 RxD green wire to connection#5 TxD yellow wire and it went to PAS-P setting the walking the bike setting
                when I have some time later I'm going to rebuild the 3 button switch and test the resistance/capacitance levels and test display and display button bypasses
                Last edited by Robert Larrison; 04-21-2017, 10:40 PM.

                Comment


                  #10
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                  • Gmullz
                    Gmullz
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Dec 2016
                    • Posts: 11
                    • Location: Super Nova Scotia

                    #1 Water Issue With Display Switch (Power Button & +/- Buttons)

                    02-03-2017, 08:50 AM
                    I was riding in wet snow a couple of days ago, and some snow must have landed on the switch, melted, and got inside.

                    When I got home I shut off the display and everything seemed fine, but when I tried to turn it back on about 15 minutes later, the display appeared dead. PAS and throttle still worked though. I unplugged the switch and plugged it back in, at which point the display came on, but looked glitched. Throttle and PAS still worked.

                    I have a spare display, so I plugged in my spare switch, and everything went back to functioning 100%. I haven't tested the old switch since - trying to let it dry out before I test it again to find out if it's toast. I actually think it'll be fine once it dries out.

                    So, I'm wondering if anyone has had this problem, and how they dealt with it. I have two goals here:

                    I want to waterproof this thing so this doesn't happen again

                    Is this possible? How would I go about it? I used silicone to waterproof my display, but I'm not sure the same method will work with this switch.

                    Is there a way I can override this switch so that I won't be stranded if this happens when I'm out somewhere?

                    I've heard you can jumper some pins to bypass the display entirely. That would then bypass this switch, correct? How do you control when the bike is on/off without the switch? It would just always be on, perhaps?

                    If this is possible, then I would carry the jumper with me in my emergency kit (I don't want to carry a spare switch with me). Or maybe it's not necessary, since it seemed like the bike still functioned even though the switch was not working properly. But it didn't seem healthy to try to operate the system with a switch that is compromised with water.
                    Last edited by Gmullz; 02-03-2017, 09:01 AM.
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                  • JPLabs
                    JPLabs
                    Moderator
                    • Join Date: Feb 2016
                    • Posts: 840
                    • Location: Michigan, USA.

                    #2
                    02-04-2017, 09:16 AM
                    You don't say what switch and display. But generally it's pretty easy as long as you can disassemble it: Take the switch apart, find the paths that water can follow to the inside, apply sealant, reassemble.

                    Or just stick a plastic baggie over it when it starts to rain.
                    Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.
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                  • Gmullz
                    Gmullz
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Dec 2016
                    • Posts: 11
                    • Location: Super Nova Scotia

                    #3
                    02-07-2017, 11:40 AM
                    Originally posted by JPLabs View Post
                    You don't say what switch and display. But generally it's pretty easy as long as you can disassemble it: Take the switch apart, find the paths that water can follow to the inside, apply sealant, reassemble.

                    Or just stick a plastic baggie over it when it starts to rain.
                    Thanks! I'll give that a go.
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                  • Robert Larrison
                    Robert Larrison
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Apr 2017
                    • Posts: 3
                    • Location: San Francisco

                    #4
                    1 week ago
                    I'm a food delivery courier so I work in the rain
                    I had the same issue on my first rain day using the DPC-14 with the 3 button switch
                    the display was glitching then stopped
                    i used my multimeter to find the problem and check the continuity of the switch

                    I removed it from the handlebars on the bottom I unscrewed the 4 tiny Phillips screws holding the plastic switch cover over a rubber gasket/switch cover underneath that is a small circuit board with 3 micro analog buttons held with 2 tiny Phillips screws

                    i dried it under a fan and it was fine the next day I leveled the button on the handlebars wondering about the gasket that worked for a few more days then it went out again so I starred using a small piece of plastic and a rubber band

                    It went out for good so I took it apart to examine it
                    They use silicone to waterproof the button and the missed 2 pins 1 wire broke at the solder joint I changed the silicone and trimmed the wire I'm going to desolder reconnect and do a better job of waterproofing it
                    i put in an order for the new display but what to do in the interim I hotwired the display
                    ​​







                    ​​​​​​
                    Attached Files
                    • Click image for larger version  Name:	IMG_20170413_083505.jpg Views:	3 Size:	216.2 KB ID:	32898

                    Last edited by Robert Larrison; 1 week ago.
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                    • JPLabs
                      #4.1
                      JPLabs commented
                      6 days ago
                      Thanks for the reminder about how to hot wire. Pic sent to my phone, and I need to tuck a jumper wire in my kit someplace, just in case.

                      As an emergency jumper wire source that's always with the bike, I think one could break a strand off the end of a shifter cable - the unused part that sticks out.
                      • Flag

                  • funwithbikes
                    funwithbikes
                    Moderator
                    • Join Date: Jan 2017
                    • Posts: 377
                    • Location: WI

                    #5
                    4 days ago
                    Water resistance is going to one of those areas in which ebikes have a long way to go :( Not all that many people ride in wet conditions for very long. With that being said, there are five basics approaches:

                    1. Replace open mechanical switches with enclosed solid state devices. We have made a lot of progress in that area as most of the variable resistor type throttles have been replace by throttles with hall effect sensors.

                    2. Slop on the dielectric grease. This is by far the least scientific approach... but it can be the most effective. Almost all water related problems are because a drop of water is shorting out two conductors. Covering the conductors with dielectric grease which usually has the consistency of vaseline prevents the water from getting onto the electrical bits.

                    3. Seal the enclosures. The third approach is to seal any opening in housing which would allow water to penetrate the housing. I am from Wisconsin where we salt our roads in the winter so I might be more extreme than most here :) I open each component which can be opened and run a thin bead of silicon wherever two halves of the enclosure come together. This includes displays, hardshell battery cases, and controller housings. Then I add a small dab of silicon wherever one or more wires penetrate an enclosure.

                    4. Design for water resistance. Always try to make sure openings face downwards and all wires have drip loops before they pass through an enclosure. you want to avoid water gathering on a wire and traveling down the wire into the enclosure.

                    5. Good old plastic bags. Whenever the weather is particularly nasty I wrap a clear plastic bag around the display.
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                  • JPLabs
                    JPLabs
                    Moderator
                    • Join Date: Feb 2016
                    • Posts: 840
                    • Location: Michigan, USA.

                    #6
                    3 days ago
                    Great advice as always.

                    I opened a failed C961 display last week, to see if I should rework my new one to seal it better. I was impressed to find it was fully sealed already. Including the remote buttons. Now I wish I'd stuck it in a bucket of water for a while first. But it looked good to me, and was bone dry inside despite considerable rain/snow use over the last year.
                    Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.
                    • Quote
                    • Comment
                    • Flag
                    • Like0

                  • Gmullz
                    Gmullz
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Dec 2016
                    • Posts: 11
                    • Location: Super Nova Scotia

                    #7
                    1 day ago
                    Originally posted by JPLabs View Post
                    Great advice as always.

                    I opened a failed C961 display last week, to see if I should rework my new one to seal it better. I was impressed to find it was fully sealed already. Including the remote buttons. Now I wish I'd stuck it in a bucket of water for a while first. But it looked good to me, and was bone dry inside despite considerable rain/snow use over the last year.
                    I actually think the display is fairly waterproof. I had one hiccup in the rain when I first got my BBSHD, and I thought it was the display acting up, but now I think it may have been the remote buttons. I have ridden through every kind of precipitation known to man, at all levels of intensity, and my display has held up well. Even at that, the remote buttons have only acted up seriously once (the reason for posting this thread). I have yet to re-test my original set of remote buttons since posting this thread.

                    Seeing this thread again has reminded me I should go through the process of trying to better seal my remote buttons.
                    • Quote
                    • Comment
                    • Flag
                    • Unlike1

                  • Gmullz
                    Gmullz
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Dec 2016
                    • Posts: 11
                    • Location: Super Nova Scotia

                    #8
                    1 day ago
                    Originally posted by Robert Larrison View Post
                    I'm a food delivery courier so I work in the rain

                    i put in an order for the new display but what to do in the interim I hotwired the display
                    ​​

                    ​​​​​​
                    Thanks for this! I am going to store this picture somewhere safe. I'll have to add a wire to my emergency kit for situations like this.

                    edit: Actually, I am reminded of this article: http://www.poweredride.com/info/dump...isplay-options

                    This will bypass the display entirely. I may just go with this method for emergency purposes.
                    Last edited by Gmullz; 1 day ago.
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                  • Robert Larrison
                    Robert Larrison
                    Newbie
                    • Join Date: Apr 2017
                    • Posts: 3
                    • Location: San Francisco

                    #9
                    14 hours ago
                    It's the buttons
                    i got the new display but it didn't work properly
                    PAS levels worked and I was able to get to settings and programming but I was getting 'error code 30'and no speedometer signal was getting to display but I was getting signal to other display and battery reading was way off
                    I checked connections and tested for signals with a multimeter

                    I needed to work so I cut the 4 button switch to splice it to the working display
                    The 750c is wired to the display it has 6 wires the 3 button switch has 5 so I opened the switch and traced the leads with the multimeter and connected it works fine except for battery voltage

                    I learned a lot from the Poweredride Dump the display article
                    I first tried using the programming cable to bypass the display but I don't have a computer to program it so it seemed to be starting in PAS 9 but when I did the same bypass to the display it would start in PAS 1 and when I would hit the 15%+ grade San Francisco hills I'd gear down and hit the throttle

                    before I spiced i made one test of the older display connected with the switch bypassed
                    I ran a jumper from connection #3 RxD green wire to connection#5 TxD yellow wire and it went to PAS-P setting the walking the bike setting
                    when I have some time later I'm going to rebuild the 3 button switch and test the resistance/capacitance levels and test display and display button bypasses
                  Last edited by Robert Larrison; 04-22-2017, 01:15 PM.

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