Luna BBSHD Ludicrous V2 controller documentation

[StvMan]

Marcos…..I am trying out a NuVinci 171 paired with my V2…….. Would it be possible to add a Motor or Chainring RPM Tachometer on the display/dashboard….I would like to use it for a shifting reference….Thx, Steve

VESC data log file link from my most recent ride..https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?...bSszYka&typo=1

[StvMan]

I was thinking of rpm/shift points in terms of throttle only/no pedaling …. But I see your point … field weakening indication works for me…

If you have any spare time (LOL) could you take a peek at the data log to see if there are any red flags in my use of the controller … the ride was representative of the single track rides I like. …

Thanks for all your work and advice!

[marcos]

could you get me the original .csv file? I see a xls file

yeah FW indicator should work better because it doesn't start at a fixed rpm, FW rpm depends a lot on battery voltage so it changes with SOC and sag. We could directly show instantaneous efficiency as well

[AZguy]

Yeah - I would think that your brain sort of knows by feel the pedal cadence but for some reason it's the one field on my display I look at very often. I nearly always pedal so it's mostly for that but it is nice on the very seldom occasions I'm going throttle only... not so much for shifting since I'll run in much lower gears when throttle only with the ring spinning faster than I can turn but when I wish to re-engage my pedaling I can shift to the appropriate higher gear for that.

For me it's no big deal since I've got a GPS with a big beautiful display that has one of the pages with ten user defined data fields along with several other predefined fields and I've got a wireless pedal cadence sensor (and wheel speed sensor, temperature and heart rate) that I can display. I didn't think I'd pay much attention to pedal cadence but like I say I'm oddly drawn to that field more than any other. I almost don't care about speed and the other useful ones are there but not looked at so frequently...

I had to look up spaceballs - that's old... looks like a star wars parody... during that time frame when I wasn't consumed with all kinds of activities/sports I was traveling all the time so no wonder I didn't get the reference... hmmm... maybe we'll give it a whirl on popcorn nite =]

[AZguy]

I know it's buried somewhere and you've probably already answered this question for but I'm being lazy - which processor is in this? I've been doing a lot of STM32 stuff lately so all crazy and super familiar with them... not hard to dive into something else though...

I promise I'll make notes this time and not ask this again

[marcos]

ah its STM32F405 running ChibiOS :)

[AZguy]

Oooooo goody... I've definitely been grooving on the STM32's lately, great ecosystem

ChibiOS is new to me but fun to learn new things, even for this old dog...

[brokejaw]

Anyone wanna sell me their v2 controller?

[AZguy]

Does anyone have a blown V2 controller that still communicates?

[marcos]

If you go that way let me know so I can send you the latest source code. I've been sloppy and too busy to get the ludi v2 code merged into the official vesc branch, but if a v2 user requests the source code I can (I have to) deliver it.

[AZguy]

One side project at a time

I've been doing an stm32 based radio linked remote sensing system for "fun" and stm32 failure analysis for business... but it's likely a good time to go hunting for a ludi2 code development platform - please let me know if you hear of anything

[marcos]

I have a bunch of non-potted controllers here that can't be sold but its up to luna management to decide if they want to distribute them as dev kits or not. Feel free to ask the luna crew though

[Tonerider]

Sure wish I could get my hands on one of these controller!

[Maro09]

My luvi2 get to hot to fast, I drove 2 miles and controller get to 120 and shut down, even if I only pedal, Any one know what is wrong?? or where I can find the best set up??
Which tempeture you guys get on the controller??
Which is a good average tempeture??

[marcos]

Hi Maro, here are some questions:
1) Was that 120°C?
2) Controller temperature or motor temperature?
3) Can you get a log of that?

I assume you saw 120°C in the android app gauges, that's motor temperature and I think is possible, kinda strange from PAS only but I guess possible if gearing was low. 50Amps for enough time can get the motor to 120°C

So yeah I would need to see some logs to see if there is a problem or not, and you would learn a lot from your own logs to optimize your power delivery as well.

[Maro09]

Marcos, I will try to get the log from the android , and posted here
And yes I saw it on the android app, turn yellow first and them red and motor stop until get cooler, I pretty sure i need to program the controller better, but let me see how I can get the logs out of the phone and put in my laptop, using Mac , and never have an android .
Still love the controller, i have 2 luna bananas, one 1 of them have the ludi2, and I can see the difference . But I am sure I doing something wrong, because after 2 miles it stop because the temperature

[bizango]

Is anyone willing to take my Ludi V2 controller and flash it/re-program it? It’s been sitting on a shelf since summer because I tried upgrading the firmware, and it stopped communicating via Bluetooth after it was finished. I probably made a mistake somewhere in the process, and it’s a brick now.

I contacted Luna, and I got some instructions that didn’t help me get any further. They said they can’t do it for me though, and I just can’t afford to spend any more time trying to learn what to do myself. I am knowledgeable in a lot of things, but this just ain’t one of them.

I’ll pay a reasonable service charge for for someone competent to help me get this sorted out. And to make the process even easier I’ll include a pre-paid return label with the package so you can just pack it back up, slap
on the label and put it in your mail box to return to me.

Thanks.
Matt

I just wonder how you came to own one of these? Random people can't get them. Many people would love the chance to get their hands on one, so you may not want to let it out of your sight.

[rtp]

Soon-to-be X2 (M600-based) owner here. Read the entire thread including comments, a couple of Marcos PRs and article, VESC site, …
Hats odd to you, Marcos - I had some concerns on what the programmability of the M600 would really look like, but this is really impressive work (former sw engineer, have managed a couple of large embedded and firmware projects)!

I got my head wrapped around the axle a bit looking for commits to vesc-project but then saw the bldc repo…
I’m assuming the Ludiv2 controller for the M600 is the same board, or next revision of the BBHSD LudiV2, and generally similar overall on the app level aside from the added tq sensor input?

Is the Android app source somewhere in bldc? (haven’t pulled it down yet but year-end ‘take vacation or lose it’ is coming…)

I also saw recent notes in vesc project about proposing an alternate license for Apple.IOS approval - as a long time Unix/Linux geek, I sort of ‘should’ like Android, but … … - if that happens, would it apply to the Android app or only vesc tools core? (as mentioned, haven’t browsed the repos much yet).

Keep up the good work - this is exciting stuff!

[marcos]

Thanks for the kind workds rtp, and congrats on your new X2 purchase!

Now that the X2 is out we are going to make another knowledge base thread this week for the M600 Ludi v2, but meanwhile I can tell you that the m600 v2 inherited the bbshd v2 schematic, with 12 fet instead of 18 fet and with canbus instead of serial (for the display) and an encoder. Torque sensing is another pretty major feature as well.
I tried the M600 v2 controller at 150Amps like the bbshd but we are talking about different motor and battery sizes so the bbshd comes with significant more punch (but not the ultimate punch as I've tested this same base schematic at 1000 Amps).

The same GUI source code builds the android, windows, linux, mac and (supposedly) IOS binaries, its the magic of Qt libraries. Code is here: https://github.com/vedderb/vesc_tool
The "luna edition" has minor usability changes that will be merged in the vanilla repo mostly because it solves a big headache for me that is distributing the android app, and solves an even bigger headache that will be IOS distribution. Hopefully we will have an IOS app for our luna bikes, but it doesn't depend on me so I'd rather not promise anything yet :)

M600 and BBSHD firmware is essentially the same, with #define switches to add or remove particular blocks of code and a different default motor parameters and limits.

[rtp]

Thanks so much for the response; looking forward to the KB write-up, Will contribute feedback best am able to.
Qt bringing flashbacks from some time back but at least it’s not TCL/Tk ;) (Did mostly backend from system services to middleware, APIs, etc. Was never a fan of front end coding, although can recognize good/poor UX and have run a few of those teams…am halfway surprised the UI isn’t a JS framework but also glad it’s not.. )

That’s great everything is or will be merged back to main; also reduces the sometimes insanity of long-running branches becoming effective forks and all the added maintenance.

I’m not expecting huge M600 power - physics has limits, but true programmability is a huge win. I think I saw reference somewhere to you using one of your controllers on a boat at crazy power levels? (‘crazy’ relative to todays factory ebike motors :) )? Sounds like you’re having fun, which is great!

Sounds like the M600 variant will support a gear or brake sensor cutoff then?

A random Q - technically it’s possible to blend inputs between cadence and torque sensors (possibly even accelerometer from the phone as unsure if controller or motors have one?). It seems like at least Innotrace takes this approach from what I can tell, with some adjustability. Will the blend of inputs be user accessible?

I suspect its only a matter of time before an Ultra-capable controller is released; will be happy with the M600 one for some time, but a fast(er) commuter may become a project down the road.. ;)

I saw a LUNA_<something> constant which is for the controller vs motor I’m assuming? Is the M600 v2 code merged at this point? Will pull the code down and see if I can find common definition files somewhere e.g for motor variants.

Will pipe down now and will keep my eyes open for the new KB updates and thanks again!

[ncmired]

Hi Marcos / Paxtana - any thoughts, comments, known compatibility issues between the V2 controller and the new Luna Lumenator motor display / headlight? Having 72 volts capability, via a display my old eyes could read, is intriguing.

[marcos]

I don't have one those with me but I just asked the guys, will get back to you.

Its mosty likely that it won't work well at 72V because I don't know who coded that firmware, which means it doesn't support the extra comm packets to show battery voltage in 72V setups. Paxtana if you can get me in contact with that developer I can talk to him like I did with eggrider

[choochoo]

Hi Marcos,

I have the v2 on two of my bikes. It’s awesome. Both use 72V 60A batteries.

One bike is a road bike. I previously used an ASI BAC 855 and just swapped over to the V2 controller. The bike looks so much cleaner!

The top speed reduced though. I previously could hit 48 mph with the BAC 855. Now I can “only” hit 43 mph. I know that’s still plenty fast, but what is the difference? Is the field weakening adjustable?

thanks

[marcos]

Field Weakening is pretty arbitrarily limited to 25A. I'm sure you can drive 50A of FW but my concern is that its too easy to run the motor like that for a long time which will invariably end up in an overheating situation, its just like abusing a stock drive at full thottle and zero RPM. FW is not adjustable from the app but it can be changed with the desktop app, although I don't recommend that.
Oh there is also an RPM limit to prevent the motor from generating >100V which would produce some ugly failure modes.

[choochoo]

Hi Marcos / Paxtana - any thoughts, comments, known compatibility issues between the V2 controller and the new Luna Lumenator motor display / headlight? Having 72 volts capability, via a display my old eyes could read, is intriguing.

Luna has confirmed that the lumenator does not work with a 72V V2 setup.

[ncmired]

Thanks guys! Oh well ...

[StvMan]

Marcos,

You stated in the last post “……. Also the v2 was designed to supply a display, not a 50W light.” ……

So does that mean that I shouldn’t use the 50w lumenator on a 52VDC V2 set up?

Steve

[marcos]

I wouldn't, there is a small 1.5A fuse that protects in case of a short circuit in the display or wiring.
With a ~50W load at min battery voltage that fuse will be flowing 1.25A, its way too close to the tripping threshold.

[ncmired]

Luna V2 controller and / versus Luna 500C display compatibility - are there any know issues? I've got both, and the display speed isn't indicating (stays "0"). But, but ... the display odometer (tenths mile) is incrementing.

This is on a motor swap bike (BBS02 to V2 BBSHD), and on which the display worked correctly.

And yes, the speed sensor light blinks in unison with wheel rotation. I didn't think to test whether the display timeout would go off, even with the bike on and running (engaged throttle).

P.S. if a related issue is already written up in the thread, apologies - I cheated and used the search.

[marcos]

um, its not a known issue. It could be a unknown issue though. I just asked the guys to give it a quick check and if they can reproduce it I'll get a display sent to me for debugging.
What would be cool is to get the app working on iPhone, wouldn't it?

[Steelsnow]

marcos Any idea on the release timeline for the iOS app for the BBSHD and X2 ludi?

[marcos]

i have no clue, I don't really know what it takes to make that happen, I just see a bunch of activity regarding this in the vesc tool repository...

[ncmired]

Thanks Marcos - tomorrow, I'll do some prelim stuff like dredging up a display from elsewhere, rechecking wheel size settings, and so forth.

I bench-fired the controller via USB before bolting it up and might have fat-fingered a setting. I had backed the max amps down to what I hope the BMS can do, and eased the throttle oomph for the Alfine IGH.

So, there's a myriad of things to go after.

[marcos]

if you are in doubt its better to reflash the firmware :)

[ncmired]

go figure - I reflashed first thing, and the display speed is happy. Well, I should say, there are speed numbers likely in the ballpark - gotta strap on the el-cheapo GPS and take the bike out for a shakedown.

Way to remote-troubleshoot there, Marcos!

By the way, which wheel size setting wins - the display or the controller?

[marcos]

Display wheel size is ignored, so set in on the controller side.

If you log the ride, in the log you can plot phone GPS speed and wheel speed in the same graph and compare them.
GPS speed reacts slower so try a long steady ride to better see the difference.

[StvMan]

Marcos … could you add data logging “on” to the default condition for both the BBSHD and the M600 V2 controllers … or at least have it default to last known switch position. … This is particularly important if the user is having Bluetooth connectivity issues … Thanks again for all of your hard work!!

[marcos]

Yes, i just added it to the to-do list.

One thing that could help... when you lose connection, you can swipe right on the left edge to pull a menu from the left edge.

When you tap "Reconnect" the logging resumes. It even continues writing the same file which is much better than having several .csv files for a single ride