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  • paxtana
    replied
    Cyclone Mini dimensions


    150 mm from center bottom to center motor

    Diameter of motor is 90mm



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    Cyclone 3000 Dimensions


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  • paxtana
    replied
    Modification for cyclone mini on a fatbike:

    Doable but needs some light modification. Longer bolts that go into the standoffs, as well as a large hoseclamp to go over the whole thing and reinforce it into position. See pics below.

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    Leave a comment:


  • paxtana
    commented on 's reply
    Are you referring to the larger bare motor? What sort of BB extension did you use?

  • paxtana
    replied
    Another interesting modification courtesy of a customer review on the gallery:

    This is a new mounting bracket for the Cyclone. It comes from a door hinge with an axel of 6mm diameter, same as the motor bolts. The bracket hangs with a 8mm bolt through the aluminum tube of the bike holding the motor. It´s very light and not difficult to cut. I think that is more safe and rigid than the clamp.

    Two pieces cut from a hinge
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    The two pieces welded
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    The mounting bracket for the cyclone. Bolted with 10mm bolt. (Editor's note: may want to reinforce with a P clamp over the downtube)
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    After painting
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  • Rodney64
    replied
    Am example of what a customer has done to make the battery more rigid on the frame:

    " I made this little aluminum
    gizmo to fit between the battery and the down tube - no welding - just slip
    fit connections and it's held in place with the same battery mounting
    screws. It's not that pretty - but it was a first go and not bad for a few
    mins work - IMHO. It's the first time I've really felt it connected. Feel
    free to share if you think will help others. Thx again for the help. Cd"


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  • tklop
    replied
    This latest beginner's guide make this the best and most comprehensive install-post ever!

    Thank you very much, paxtana!

    I can personally verify the 68mm bottom-bracket Cyclone 4000W kit installation process is identical, with the simple addition of a bottom-bracket extension, with an extra support bearing.

    Best of luck with your projects, everyone!

    Take care,

    tklop
    Last edited by tklop; 05-07-2018, 12:29 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • paxtana
    replied
    Complete Beginners Guide to Cyclone Installation


    Tools needed: chain breaker tool, bottom bracket remover tool, bottom bracket lockring tool, and crank arm remover. You also will need some standard tools such as a set of Allen keys, and adjustable and/or socket wrench.

    Removal:

    First thing you need to do is remove everything from the bottom bracket shell. This is what it should look like once finished:

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    First we remove the pedals. The pedals have a standard bolt in it. Depending on the type this may be removed with either an allen key or a socket wrench.
    Here is an example of both types

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    At this point you will see the cranks have basically a large threaded hole. It looks like this, note the threads at the edge of the hole, this is what we thread the crank puller into.
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    Now you need the crank arm puller. Here is a common one. Note: once the silver portion is well threaded into the black portion, it will take a significant amount of force. Continue tightening, and the crank will separate.
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    See here for a video of how this works:


    Now we are down to the actual bottom bracket. You need a bottom bracket remover tool which fits directly into the splines on the BB cups. Here is an example.
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    Keep in mind that the right side cup (AKA the drive side, the side with the gears on it) is reversed threaded. So you would turn it clockwise to loosen.
    If the bike is particularly rusty or otherwise problematic, keep in mind that you may need to use a significant amount of force to remove the cups. If you cannot manage to get this done you can likely take this to your local bike shop and have them do it. Despite some bike shops not working on electric bikes they will have no problem removing components in order to help you prep for your electric bike conversion.

    After this is done you can simply slide out the entire bottom bracket assembly from the bottom bracket shell. Congratulations!

    Installation:

    Now comes the part where you do the installation as shown in the videos previously mentioned in the main documentation. These are critical to watch.
    We recommend watching both of these videos for info on how to do cyclone installation, regardless of if you are installing 120mm or standard size as they can provide helpful info.

    The kit you just received will have different hardware than what you have seen on the product listing and will also slightly differ from the following videos. Rest assured you are not missing anything. You only need one long button head bolt (for the tensioner) and two stubby spacer to install between the thick plate and the motor! If your kit came with an extra long bolt just take the shorter one of the 2. This bolt is are only used for the chain tensioner.

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    Highly recommended to watch these videos as you are actually doing the installation, such as on a laptop while you are working on the bike.

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    Now you can attach the chainring and tensioner

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    Alignment
    Before proceeding check that you have proper alignment between motor sprocket, chainring sprocket and tensioner. If not you may need to use bottom bracket spacers on the bottom bracket, or washers on the motor mounts, depending on which part needs aligned. See the picture below for a reference where the chainring needed to go further outbound

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    Now ensure that the motor is rotated up as much as you can so it has good clearance over curbs once motor has been installed.

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    The hoseclamp
    This is optional but can help to keep the motor affixed in place as far upwards as possible. The hose clamp just goes over the motor itself and provides a point for the ziptie to be affixed from downtube to motor itself. Essentially reinforcing it in position.
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    The chain
    you want to use the properly sized chain for however many sprockets you have on the rear cassette, for example if it is a 9 speed rear cassette you want a 9 speed chain. Ideally a new chain. Use the chain breaker tool to shorten it to however much length you specifically need for your build.

    For the chain from the motor to the chainring you need a single speed chain, also known as a BMX chain. Typically if you buy this in a bike shop you will get a very large amount and you need to shorten it quite a bit, if you buy it from Luna where we sell it by the foot you probably want a few feet.

    Make sure each link in the chain is bending correctly and that the masterlink (the link used to join the chain together) is properly used so it also bends. If not this needs to be addressed.

    Test the chain by either turning the cranks or hitting throttle; the chain should not skip.

    NOTE: A half link can be added if you need the chain to be shorter. Somtimes removing a full link will make the chain too short.

    The tensioner
    This is what not to do:
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    In the above picture, the user was trying to push the chain outward with the tensioner. We want to pull the chain inward.

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    A marked improvement here, though the chain needs to be shortened or it will not work.
    This is how we want it:
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    Here is an alternative to mounting the spring to the bolt seen pictured. In this picture the user has run a ziptie over the downtube and has affixed the tensioner spring directly to that ziptie. Either way will work, just as long as you are having it pull that tensioner upwards so the spring is providing tension.
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    Now that we have the tensioner in basically the correct position we need to make sure it is horizontally aligned.
    From Karl at electricbike-blog:
    If you didn’t adjust the spacing of the drive side bracket then the main chain wheel and the drive gear should line up pretty well. The tensioning wheel will have to be adjusted so it lines up between the two which is actually pretty easy. Just sight down the gears and loosen the bolt that attached the tensioning gear to the motor. Once it is lined up correctly then tighten down the nut against the motor housing so that bolt won’t turn at a later time.
    The controller
    The controller doesn't really need to be secured you can use zip ties
    Last edited by Rodney64; 05-21-2018, 08:55 PM.

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  • paxtana
    replied
    Service

    At some point you may need to remove the freewheel / sprocket, for example if the teeth wear out.
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    How to remove this is fairly simple. First use a standard crank arm puller to remove the crank. The freewheel itself is attached to the crankarm.
    Now you need to remove freewheel from crank. This can be done with a single speed freewheel removal tool. Below is a park tool fr-6. Others may also work.
    park tool fr6
    Insert tool into notches on the freewheel and turn to unscrew it from the crankarm.

    Leave a comment:


  • max_volt
    commented on 's reply
    I always short the leads together 1st to make sure the checker is functioning properly. Yes the audible type meter is highly desirable.

  • paxtana
    replied
    Troubleshooting

    Unlike Bafang mid drives which use prefabricated connectors, Cyclone connectors take a different approach, using off the shelf components. This keeps cost low and also makes the connectors easily testable, but on occasion a wire inside a connector may come unseated. This can be tested with a multimeter doing simple continuity testing if it is not visually obvious. While connections between individual wires are not easily testable in specially made connectors such as the HIGO used by Bafang, this is testable here.

    Below is a simple guide on how to use a multimeter to test whether a length of wire with a connector between it has a good connection, by pushing the multimeter leads through the insulation while in continuity mode. Do this on either side of the connector for each individual wire. If it beeps you have a good connection. If it does not beep this is most likely where your problem is, which may entail needing the wire reseated inside the connector, replacing the connector, or replacing the pin inside the connector.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sebz
    replied
    Wiring diagram:

    This is for the stock 40amp controller but the battery and motor connections in this diagram (the right side of this diagram) can be applied to any of the cyclone controllers including the ASI.

    If you have any questions or if the colors do not match please contact us.

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    Note: As seen in diagram you must have the red switch wire connected to positive coming from the battery. In the video below the original wiring needed to be quickly replaced so since the wiring needed redone we shot a quick video on how to do this. If using the included wiring this may or may not be plug and play depending on what you are doing.
    Last edited by Sebz; 02-27-2018, 01:15 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • paxtana
    started a topic Cyclone documentation

    Cyclone documentation

    There are many options and what you want will vary depending on your goals and the bike itself.
    We will start by measuring the bike, then go over the options available and finally, installation instructions.

    Measurement
    We will not cover disassembly or other topics that can be researched elsewhere, if you need this info please see this link.
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    Start by measuring the width of the bottom bracket shell, from face to face. Do not measure any bearings or other pieces, you are looking for the bottom bracket shell width only. Measure it twice. 99.9% of you will have a measurement between 68mm and 120mm. If its not, then it is an install that is outside the scope of this article.

    Remove the bottom bracket from the bottom bracket shell using the appropriate tools, this is a job for your local bike shop if you don't have the tools, patience or knowhow. Even if you do have the tools, some of them can be very stubborn to come out even if the bike is brand new.

    If your bottom bracket shell has threads on the inside this is great news, it means your style of bottom bracket will likely take the BBS motor without needing an adaptor. Threaded bottom bracket shells are called JIS or BSA standard and this is what the Bafang motor kit was designed to work with. The inside diameter of your JIS-BSA shell should be 33.8mm +/- .2mm. Check it. Twice.

    If your bottom bracket does NOT have threads, but has pressed in bearings, don't panic. Yet.
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    There are adaptors for some of the most common press fit style bottom brackets, not all but some. There is an article discussing adaptors and press fit bottom brackets here, to determine what kind of non-threaded BB you have and if you can get an adaptor or if you are out of luck.

    At this point you have a bike with a bottom bracket shell between 68 and 120mm and it is a JIS-BSA type or you have to use an adapter to make it standard BSA diameter.


    Next thing you need to do is determine which size (length) bottom bracket you should order. The following compatibility chart shows where you should START, do not skip ahead and order yet! Match your width with the BB type to tell you what bottom brackets you can use.

    68-73mm ~83mm 100mm 120mm
    BSA Standard Square Tapered BB 68-83mm, ISIS BB 68-73mm Standard Square Taper BB 83-100mm, Square taper 68-83mm (use a spacer bearing), ISIS BB 83mm Standard Square Taper BB 83-100mm, ISIS BB 100mm Standard Square Taper BB - 120mm, ISIS BB 120mm
    (Pressfit) BB30 BB30 Adapter required BB30 Adapter required BB30 Adapter required BB30 Adapter required
    (Pressfit) PF30 PF30 Adapter required PF30 Adapter required PF30 Adapter required PF30 Adapter required
    (Pressfit) PF41 PF41 Adapter required PF41 Adapter required PF41 Adapter required PF41 Adapter required
    Eccentric (Old-style American aka Ashtabula) Eccentric Adapter required Eccentric Adapter required Eccentric Adapter required Eccentric Adapter required
    Anything else Not likely Not likely Not likely Not likely

    At this point you should know what BB will fit.

    Motor types
    Essentially we have three different Cyclone versions. The 3000, the Mini, and the Monster. The 3000 is by far the most popular.
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    The Mini is more lightweight and lower powered while also being a bit more stealthy. The monster is very large and heavy and can only be used with a 120mm since it needs at least this width for the cranks to clear the motor, as well as needing a special battery for all the current it pulls. The 3000 strikes the best balance between power and size.

    For this guide we will assume your choice is the 3000w version.


    Options

    Chainrings
    Now that you know the motor you want you likely have the choice of ISIS or square taper BB. The ISIS BB is well made with good tolerances and uses the latest bicycle crankset standard. However the square taper BB is required for use with the Luna-tic crankset, which is a heavy duty crankset with an especially heavy duty freewheel specifically designed to handle high power. It is by far the most durable crankset on the market for cyclone.
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    Many people choose one or the other, ISIS with one of the standard cranksets or square taper with the Luna-tic crankset. If you truly wanted the best of both worlds you could modify it to combine an ISIS BB with the Luna-tic chainwheel.

    Next option is the triple chainring, this is a good option for folks that do not want to compromise by optimizing their bike for torque or speed, but instead want both. With a triple chainring you essentially double your gear range. You have one gear going from the motor to the chainring, and the other two are going to the rear cassette on your bike. So if you have a 9 speed rear, instead of having a 9 speed ebike this triple chainring gives you an 18 speed ebike. All of the chainrings will give very good torque but this may be a good option if you still want to go 40+ MPH while you have that much torque, and while still maintaining peak efficiency.

    Please note that if you use the triple chainring you cannot use a front derailleur to change between the rings, you will need to manually take the chain with your fingers and move it to the other chain ring.

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    Included controller
    We currently have two options, either stock or ASI. Stock is 40A, easily replaceable, and usable with all accessories such as PAS sensor and 3-speed switch. ASI is sinewave, which is both a significant increase in efficiency as well as quieter operation and more durability. There are two different versions of the ASI programming we offer on this controller for the 3K, one that is 2000W and the other at 4000W. Both the stock controller and the 4000W ASI should be used with a high power battery but this is especially so with the 4000W ASI. For the 2000W version you can use a battery with a lower constant discharge rate.

    For example, with stock you may be able to use our shark pack with 30A continuous/50A peak BMS, but this would not be enough for the 4000W ASI as it can peak higher than 50A and may be higher than 30A continuous depending on riding conditions. For a controller pulling that much power we would typically recommend one of our high power softpack batteries with 50A continuous/ 70A peak BMS. But if you select the 2000W version or even the 3000W stock controller, a pack with 30A BMS (i.e., most of the batteries we sell) should be fine under most circumstances.

    This is not a typical controller where power is measured based on current, it is based on wattage. So if you have a lower voltage, it's going to pull more amperage. Wattage is peak rating on these option descriptions, not continuous. So a 4000W is programmed to run for up to 4000W, 2000W is programmed to run for up to 2000W.
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    Warning about options for ASI controller

    No extra accessories currently work with ASI. No PAS sensor, 3 speed switch, or ebrakes. If these options are important to you, select stock controller.


    Bluetooth controller: Sometimes we have BT controller option. If upgrading to the Bluetooth controller or needing info on it, see the controller's listing for documentation. If using bluetooth controller option it has a smartphone app to use phone as display. This app is on the controller listing. 40A version here ... 60A version here

    Display
    The kit will function perfectly with no display. However if you want a full featured display we recommend the Batt-Man.
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    This shows power being used, has a programmable gauge, speedometer and is easy to use. Click the image above for more details.

    Custom Mount
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    These custom mounts are offered due to customer requests for a more robust mount solution than the default mount provided with the kit. It can also be custom strengthened for even more rigidity if you so choose, see this link.

    Throttle Options
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    Click the image to see full description on each throttle. Much of this is down to personal preference. The Oro throttles do not have keyed on/off switch, if this is a priority then you want one of the other types.

    Crank Arm Set
    This one is fairly straightforward. If you have selected a an ISIS BB you need an ISIS crankset. If you have selected the Luna-tic crankset you need square taper.

    Ebrake Cutoff Sensors
    This is a standard safety power cutoff sensor. It is set up in such a way that pulling the lever pulls the magnet away from the sensor. Once the magnet/sensor is far enough away, power cuts on the throttle. Often this is positioned using epoxy adhesive to affix the sensor and magnet in the proper position. Note: If the throttle does not work when this is plugged in you have the magnet too far from the sensor.

    Cadence Sensor for Pedal Assist
    Standard PAS sensor. Please note this is only compatible with stock controller.


    Motor sizing
    This is the latest cyclone kit with new and improved mounting brackets that mimimize frame flex and eliminate the need for the janky looking Hose clamp. The picture below illustrates the difference between the 68mm and fat bike kits. We ship whichever mount corresponds with the bottom bracket you select in the order.
    3000w-motor.jpg
    Installation

    Click here to go to the beginners guide to Cyclone installation, or simply scroll down to post #5 on this page


    Other components
    Another optional component on this kit is the 3 speed switch, available here. Confirmed usable with stock and bluetooth controller, please contact support for confirmation on its use with other controllers.

    FAQ
    What sort of chain do I need?
    Different sized chain depending on whether it is going to the motor or the rear. Single speed going to motor and regular chain going to rear.

    Does the Cyclone 3000 offer multiple levels of pedal assist?
    No, the PAS is only at full power same as throttle. unless you can install a 3 speed switch to it.


    Details on wiring: Wiring diagram


    How to adjust a 68mm square taper Cyclone BB for more width with a spacer

    Legacy installation instructions
    These instructions were written for previous versions and as such are obsolete. They may still be useful if you would like to be more familiar with how Cyclone works.
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