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**Milo** · 05-28-2017, 06:14 PM

Can a Thune torque sensing bottom bracket be run with the double gear hub motor? If yes can you point me to the instructions?

**thedadude** · 05-30-2017, 03:19 PM

Newbie looking into using a double torque double gear on 1st build
Am looking into alternatives for my wife to ride. Has a Trek Shift 2 Hybrid/comfort bike, 21 speed with twist shifts. Was looking at the double torque/double gear Luna kit. The front has suspension w/ 100mm front dropout, so that is out. The rear has 135mm droputs so the dt/dg rear motor setup appears to be 145mm and would also need to have 10mm spread to fit the rear drops on this bike. It is an aluminum frame, so...is there a way to spread this frame to fit or am I out of luck? The bike is setup with V brakes so there is no disc conflict, though I do see some post indicating problems with centering of the wheel, would this also be a concern?
Failing this, what alternatives are out there that fit this rig?

**thedadude** · 05-30-2017, 09:45 PM

I looked at that kit, however:
1. The Smart Pie kIt obviously does not have the double torque/double gear key features, the power and torque limitations of the single speed hub design from the research I have done, make a single speed hub a sub-optimal choice...although we do not do a lot of climbing or heavy hauling so maybe this is not that big a deal. I guess, this is the compromise for the cost effectiveness and simplicity of a hub upgrade kit vs new build. (Why not suck 10mm out SOMEPLACE! The DT/DG could be sooo much more universal!). I presume however that the Smart Pie kit, with a 48v battery, and the 20A controller, would be able to generate around ~1000 peak watts, so enough to climb a hill, although not a steep one, with some peddle help.
2. The Smart Pie does not appear to have the programmable display system as provided in the DT/DG kit system (which looks really NICE!). A basic display appears to be an option, however, w/o a PAS system would be of limited use ....what does it do?
3. The Smart Pie kit shows a twist grip throttle provided with a horn/cruise lock button on one grip (left?), and battery indicator/throttle on the other(right?), which would be incompatible with her existing dual twist grip shifter setup. I see there is a thumb throttle available, however not sure how this would work without the horn/throttle lock grip installed on the other (left)side, and without that, the thumb throttle only would be troublesome to use. It also does not appear to have a PAS system provided. Does that kit come with a PAS sensor system and if not, is this hub motor/controller compatible with a PAS system?
4. It appears to have an integral hub controller...which concerns me given they appear to be more prone to over-heating issues ... we do live in the desert.
5. Presume this kit would be compatible with the batteries/chargers from Luna, specifically the 48V Side Shark and 3 way charger. This battery has a charge indicator, which in her step thru setup I would anticipate mounting on existing down tube bottle cage holes. Does this make the charge indicator on the hand grip redundant? Also presume I would need to purchase the converter from 5.5mm barrel to XT female plug. Does this battery "plug and play" with the balance of this Smart Pie kit?
I am climbing the learning curve on these systems, so apologize for my limited knowledge dumb questions. Thank you and the members of this forum for your helpful suggestions and advice. I am attempting to do ALL my homework before plunking down $1K or more on an E-system. So far, from my limited research it looks like Luna does a great job trying to provide cost effective quality systems with reasonably simple setups.I appreciate your help in clarification of the benefits and limitations of the various systems, there are a lot of choices and it would be very easy to buy an incompatible setup and waste a lot of time and money.

**Brendon1128** · 05-31-2017, 04:19 AM

Ive been riding on smart pie kits for about 5 years now. Heres my two cents:

1 - The smart pie works best with light pedalling assist. Its geared towards the high end so it loves to spin. I normally cruise at 28+ mph. In terms of hill climbing, Ive never run into hill I couldnt climb as long as you give the motor some assistance. If I lived in somewhere like San Fran, I might look for a geared motor. Note that I run 52v batteries for a little extra power. The controllers are rated up to 63v.

2 - Golden motors display is junk. I wouldnt waste your money on it. PAS is compatible but youd need to set up a sensor. The smart pie has a ton of plug points which I dont use. I just go for the twist throttle motorcycle setup

3 - GM offers a thumb throttle. You can mount it on either side. The battery indicators are kinda junk. They dont tell you the exact level of your battery, only using a vague 3 light system that often isnt accurate

4 - Never had an issue with overheating. Granted I live in Boston so the hottest day Ive used my bike was about 97 degrees. The motor does get hot to the touch if you run it for a long ride hard on the throttle. My current motor Ive logged 5000+ miles on. Honestly I dont think ambient temperature makes a huge difference. Ive cycled when it was 10 degrees outside and thought it would keep the motor cool. It still got hot to the touch.

5 - You can hook up any battery to the Smart pie as long as it is under 63v fully charger. It has open compatibility and programable so you can manuallynset the voltage limits. You can also restrict speed and amp draw.

**thedadude** · 06-01-2017, 12:27 AM

Thanks for the feedback Brendon, guess the biggest question I have now is the PAS system. The kit does not appear to come with one, and don't think the bride wants a throttle only setup. I am looking at using the Side Shark bat, which has a charge indicator (she rides a step thru so can mount battery on down tube cage mount so s/b visible), so the thumb throttle 3 light charge status w/b redundant. I looked at the Smart Pie and does not appear that Luna offers to include a PAS sensor, so is this an option to purchase and hookup? I know I am kinda hijacking this DT/DG thread, so apologize, but is the PAS sensor is important. If I am now posting in the wrong place, is there a better place in this forum for my questions since it appears I need to move on from the DT/DG power plant?

**Alan B** · 06-01-2017, 07:22 AM

The BBSHD PAS is highly tunable, many folks are happy with it. The best PAS setups generally use a torque sensor but those are spendy and not common on DIY kits.

Back on Topic, the double speed / double torque kit I am testing came with a PAS sensor. I haven't installed or tested that part yet.

**CA Delta Flatlands** · 07-29-2017, 04:16 PM

I just installed the kit on my wife's cargo bike. Despite issues with getting my front brake attached due to lack of clearance - my primary issue is that the motor is not able to sense speed. Has anyone else experienced this or have a fix?

Also, who else has a 2 piece crankset and what have you done to get the PAS sensor installed? I have a shimano zee crankset on the bike, but I can swap the bike to a 22/24 truvativ/sram one off of another bike if needed.

**Dan5** · 08-30-2017, 04:30 PM

Hello Everyone,

Connected to the controller of the "Double Gear / Double Torque Motor", there is a cable with a yellow higo connector (please see the included picture).

Does anyone know what this cable is for?

Thank you.

Dan

**Gigawatt** · 10-07-2017, 12:31 PM

Hello,

Has anyone installed this motor (front hub) on an Edgerunner?

Thanks,
Gigawatt

**Nozrydr** · 11-06-2017, 12:44 PM

How to get the freehub body off and then find a shorter freehub (is there such a thing that would fit this) ?

$64K question is "How to fit this unit in the 145mm drops?"

Hoping I can buy a vowel here and get some tips to break out of a bit of a dead end I find myself in.
Got over the discomfort with building up the wheel with zero dish on the disc side (weird... still a bit of a cringe).

Problem is, the freehub body stands 8-10mm proud of the cassette side dropout. Wouldn't be prudent to try spreading that Al frame. Especially as heavy as this bike might run loaded.

So how to get the freehub body off this motor? Not like a normal bike rear through axle you can slip out to get at the freehub...(?)

I pulled the old 350W Bafung hub motor thinking this was going to be a fairly straight forward matter of building up a wheel and installing the new electrics. Oh well, it's an adventure at least.

Well, at least that’s the only solution w/out cutting_spreading_rewelding the aluminum frame. Which would be fun but… projects backlog.

**calfee20** · 11-06-2017, 01:27 PM

Originally posted by Nozrydr View Post

How to get the freehub body off and then find a shorter freehub (is there such a thing that would fit this) ?

$64K question is "How to fit this unit in the 145mm drops?"

Hoping I can buy a vowel here and get some tips to break out of a bit of a dead end I find myself in.
Got over the discomfort with building up the wheel with zero dish on the disc side (weird... still a bit of a cringe).

Problem is, the freehub body stands 8-10mm proud of the cassette side dropout. Wouldn't be prudent to try spreading that Al frame. Especially as heavy as this bike might run loaded.

So how to get the freehub body off this motor? Not like a normal bike rear through axle you can slip out to get at the freehub...(?)

I pulled the old 350W Bafung hub motor thinking this was going to be a fairly straight forward matter of building up a wheel and installing the new electrics. Oh well, it's an adventure at least.

Well, at least that’s the only solution w/out cutting_spreading_rewelding the aluminum frame. Which would be fun but… projects backlog.

Grin ebikes has 5-9 speed freewheels that vary in stack height from 31mm to 42mm. http://www.ebikes.ca/shop/electric-b...reewheels.html

As far as getting it out you need a splined tool with a hole large enough to fit the axle through. http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...hubs&FORM=IGRE

**paxtana** · 11-06-2017, 01:53 PM

Nozrydr hopefully this helps:

**Nozrydr** · 11-06-2017, 02:23 PM

Calfee20,
Thanks, I'll go shopping to see if I can find a tool that works.

Thanks Pax, No cigar on that one though in this case. That's the normal freehub removal action. Problem here is the axle doesn't drop out like on a normal hub.

**commuter ebikes** · 11-06-2017, 04:15 PM

Originally posted by Nozrydr View Post

Calfee20,
Thanks, I'll go shopping to see if I can find a tool that works.

Thanks Pax, No cigar on that one though in this case. That's the normal freehub removal action. Problem here is the axle doesn't drop out like on a normal hub.

I understand that you are trying to remove the freehub body so as to replace it with a shorter freehub body. Do you have other pictures of this? All I could find was these two pictures:

**paxtana** · 11-06-2017, 04:28 PM

I think the axle will drop out when the casing is removed by unscrewing it utilizing those boltholes as shown in the above pic.
See the video below where the axle drops out.

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