Want to build a Full Suspension Mid-Fat BBSHD MB and need to find the right bike/fit.

[toddphillips]

Wow! I hadn't thought of that. What about the fact that Luna bikes do not have torque sensing? One aspect that makes type 1 bikes less appealing to me is the fact that with the ones I rented with torque sensing I was sometimes putting in more effort than I was wanting to even in the highest pedal assist mode. Without torque sensing a 750w Bafang would allow much more power when I wanted it.

[Peter Halt]

You can unhook or remove throttle and easily limit any luna kit to 20 mph from the display settings if you want to be legal on a California trail.

[toddphillips]

After reading your comments I went by my local ebike store to see what they had to say. They rent and sell the ebikes I've seen on single track here at Wilder Ranch State Park. I was told that we have it pretty good in Santa Cruz. The owner said he has talked to local officials and that type 1 ebikes, which are what they sell, are allowed on all bike trails in Wilder Ranch, UCSC, Pogonip, Henry Cowell State Park, Delaveaga Park, Big Basin, and Nisene Marks, the first three of which have some single track. Basically I was told they are allowed every place on the link I sent you except for Soquel Demonstration State Forest. Of course they are a bike store, so they may be biased. It does make me think twice about what kind of ebike I am going to build. Because of throttles and no 20mph speed limiters a Luna kit would make it a type 3 ebike, which would not be legal in any place I mentioned. Still learning...

[toddphillips]

Ok, thanks for your reply. I did a bit of digging after reading your reply and clearly I didn't realize this issue was so touchy, contentious and unclear. I have definitely seen other ebikes on the single track at Wilder Ranch, where I would like to ride. I've also rented ebikes to ride up there. I will definitely check more with the local community and maybe even rethink what kind of bike I'd like to build. Really I think I'd be super happy to have a fattie hard tail and lots of dirt roads to explore. Thanks again. It takes a village!

[fatEbike.LA]

That applies only to bike lanes on streets and paved bike paths. This law does not have any effect on local land access, so far most state parks and all forestry service and national park lands still consider ebikes to be motorized vehicles and ban them. This is a very very touchy issue in the mountain bike community with lots of bicyclists looking for an excuse to ban us forever. All it will take is one episode of illegal riding in front of the wrong people and we are will never get access to single track.

I checked the map and I don't think any of the single track there is legal for ebikes although you may find a fire road that allows dirt bikes.... If there is any doubt, just call or email any local bike shop or MBOSC, they will tell you where it is legal to ride. Please don't ruin it for everyone else who might have hopes of legally riding there someday by thinking that no one will notice the motor.

[toddphillips]

That is awesome information! Just what I needed to know! Now I just need to try them for fit and get more clear about how good the suspensions are. I'm a little sad to be possibly giving up the mid-fat option, but I like the simplicity of simply transferring my BBS02 onto one of these.

[toddphillips]

I'm no expert, but my understanding that as long at it's a class 1 or class 2 ebike, then it can go where ever other mountain bikes go.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=312.5.&lawCode=VEH

And there are plenty of places in Santa Cruz where there is some singletrack and MB are allowed.

http://mbosc.org/trails-in-santa-cruz/

[toddphillips]

Thank you! I took a quick look and that setup looks awesome for dirt roads and trails. I wish I had more access to terrain like that. I will consider it.

[fatEbike.LA]

Where can you legally ride an ebike on single track in the Santa Cruz mountains? I am not that far away now and I'd like to check them out over the winter when it is cooler weather.

[Harold]

I like the fat frames for their versatility. If the fattest tire your going to use is a 3.2 the mid fats would offer the same advantage. I rode on Skyline in San Mateo for 10 yrs on my Intense with 2.1 tires which worked fine in the dry. I now have the Intense set up with 50mm rims and 2.3 tires which actually measure close to 2.6" which would work better on those trails.
I built 2 f/s bikes this year by buying the new frames on ebay then piecing them together. The price came out the same as buying the complete bike.
My wife has a 2005 Santa Cruz Superlight with top components we picked up on ebay for $900, that's still a great bike to ride. I'd convert it to a bbshd and mighty mini battery if she wanted.
As far as a fork I would post on the local mtn bike forum and ask for suggestions based on the local trails and how you ride.

[Waterat Pat]

Todd you can't go wrong with a Santa Cruz and they all have standard threaded bottom brackets. The Nickel is 27.5 wheel compatible I believe should you want to go that route. The Heckler has a straight downtube which should allow you to rotate the motor forward for more clearance.

[toddphillips]

Here are 3 local bikes for sale. Not mid-fat, but they might work. Do you think I could fit my shark pack on these?
2008 Gaint Trance 3, the guy offered $500. https://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/bik...383599856.html
2011 Santa Cruz Nickel $700. https://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/bik...393345920.html
2003 rebuilt Santa Cruz Heckler $1000, and XL! https://sfbay.craigslist.org/scz/bik...362668794.html And it's pretty :^)

[Bizman]

Todd,
I see you want a more upright riding position. A suggestion would be to check out Jonesbikes.com and at the minimum check out the Jones H Loop bar. I bought the 29er + bike with this bar, added the Xtracycle LEAP extension converting it to a cargo bike. I then added the BBSHD with 42t Luna Eclipse front chain ring and 11-42 rear cassette. This bike has 29er + 3" tires so I am unable to get the lowest cassette gear due to the rear chain line/3" tire issue (a smaller tire would solve this or better yet IGH!), BUT, it pedals like a regular bike and it has a motor if I need it, hence having that lowest gear is not much of a problem! This bike is my most comfortable 2 wheeled bike! I tried to find Jeffs video on how he designed this bike and bars and post the link but I could not find it (perhaps ask them how to find it on the website)?. That video is what sold me on this bike and bars, I highly recommend both bike & bars/ just bike/or just bars. You could use the bars on most bikes (I believe)! You could also at adapt any gearing you would like.

I realize this does not have suspension but if you check out his website and videos he uses a "truss" front fork and with the 3" tires it will give you some squish. I do not ride (nor did I get it for) single track, mostly paved and back dirt roads, it is just a wonderful geometry and the bars are so comfortable, although YRMV. I was never a fan of rails to trails but a friend had a 62nd birthday and wanted to ride that many miles on his birthday, in a nutshell I rode 76 miles that day, NO motor usage at all and I could have went a 100 no problem! I think I never had the right fitting bike for that type of riding until building this one. I have been very happy with the geo and bars on this bike and share my good experience with everyone I know that wants to have a more upright and comfortable riding position, good luck, I wish you the best with your search!

[Zippy]

This blog on bottom brackets standards and fitting the motors is informative, there is also one written by Luna folks that's good too although I don't have the link for that: https://www.empoweredcycles.com/blog...d-drive-motors

[toddphillips]

Also I'm wondering about how you find the geometry of a fatty differs from an all mountain bike? Fatties seem a bit more like a cruiser to me, and I do want to sit a bit more upright. But if that's true, how is it for lots of climbing up and down hills and single track?