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Yikes-Clicking sound and no power

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    Yikes-Clicking sound and no power

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Name:	my bike.JPG
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ID:	15690 Hello All, 60 year old biker in san francisco here. i recently purchased a mid drive ebike on craigslist (mountain bike with bbs02? 750w and 48v? battery) and i'm still getting it figured out. i've been searching the forum to find answers but can't seem to locate the same topic. i would really appreciate your help.
    my bike was working well yesterday (maybe 1 mile ride) and today when i pulled it out i checked the push button battery gauge on the dolphin pack it lit up all the bars. when i now turn on the display (C965) it lights up, displays the usual stuff, but then it shows a flashing empty battery and shuts off after a second or two. while this is going on i noticed i hear clicking sounds down by my battery. when i try to charge the battery my charger says the battery is fully charged, and when i push the button on the pack it still shows all bars lit up.
    Can anyone diagnose this? Many thanks!
    Last edited by limhrod; 08-27-2016, 05:09 PM.

    update: now the display will not light up/turn on at all- but the battery pack still shows full charge. there is no torque sensor that i can see and the brake sensors are not connected. i would surmise that i have a pinched cable somewhere but i do not see any obvious cut wires or loose connections. i suppose its time to seek out a fuse (if one exists?) on the battery pack and see if its fried?


      Have you checked the battery with a multimeter? When you last rode the bike what voltage did you run the pack down to? No fuse unless you put one inline. Check all connections, sounds like a bad connection somewhere if its clicking. Was the bike wet? and did any error code display at all?


        First thing is to take the battery off the bike and check the output terminals with a meter to see if there is full voltage available there. Post your results.


          thank you both for your tips. i've not had the chance to ever really run the battery down very far and i've not gotten any error code yet. i've got to search this site to figure out how to 'check the output terminals with a meter' as i'm not really sure how to do that (and i read on here that someone did it incorrectly and "arced" or shorted something.) my pack is all contained so i'm guessing i check the round plug that makes contact with the rack on the down tube?

          i just went down to check the bike and sure enough when i turn it on now everything lights up and shows normal and fully charged on the display and did not turn off after a few minutes. i haven't gotten a chance to ride it yet but will report back once i do. thanks again!


            UPDATE: i took the bike on a little 4 mile ride and everything is working normally. i guess that means my battery is fine and that i have some kind of crimp or loose connection somewhere. which leads me to my next question..there seems to be quite a bit of extra wire that just gets looped around on my seat tube. can i shorten these wires to get rid of the excess? if i use good butt splicing technique (as i've seen on this site) am i still just looking for trouble? i also have the excess cables that i believe go to the brake sensors (that i am not going to hook up anyway)-can i just cut these off? it seems like if i have to look for a crimp i might as well tidy up/shorten my excess wire while i'm at it..bad idea?? and while i'm at it, is there a good way for me to identify my bafang unit and battery capacity?? many thanks! Click image for larger version

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              YIKES!! That's quite the sloppy install! Since the Dolphin pack has a nice on off switch you can shorten the wires from the battery, and the motor, The red and black pairs and just solder the connection. Those pinched cables, especially the harness with the connections for the display and brakes can be a problem if kinked. That may be the older 40 inch harness. I just changed mine out for the charter 30" and don't have as much excess wire to deal with.

              Underneath the motor are the motor serial and codes. Knowing which model will help sorting what the battery is, but won't definitively tell you. Any idea where the kit came from?


                thanks for that tip. i believe the kit came from empowered cycles in castro valley california but unfortunately i've lost the phone number of the fellow who i bought this from so i'm not certain. all that excess cable is driving me nuts so i'm happy to do some surgery!


                  Click image for larger version

Name:	bbs02 750w.JPG
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ID:	15824 alright! i cut out lots of cable/wire and straightened out what had been pinched and everything went well on my test ride. guess i'll have to give it a few rides to be sure. also, thanks to your tips i found out what bafang i have-thanks! Click image for larger version

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                    Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2016-08-29 at 9.55.45 AM.png
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ID:	15866 A good picture of the BBS02 68MM kit adapted to a 73MM bottom bracket!



                      aaaarrrrgghhh! spoke too soon. i had a good long few rides and everything seemed fine. now i can't get the display to turn on whatsoever. so i undid all my wiring and tried to find a disconnect. i tested for continuity in the harness and everything was ok. i briefly looked at the controller connections and everything seemed ok. i tested (?) my battery sort of, by charging it, pushing the button shows all bars lit up, the usb port was able to put out power, and the 30 amp fuse on the pack is not fried. continuity between the battery cradle and the anderson connectors was good. still no power up! i've ordered a new harness and c965 from luna (and those xt90-s pigtails while i'm at it) and will try again with the new stuff.
                      wondering if there is anything else i can try while i'm waiting for the parts?

                      i have not ridden the bike very long distances but i live on top of a steep hill in san francisco. i always pedal and sometimes use the throttle but try to keep up the rpms on the hills. wondering if i've burnt out controller/mosfets??? before it died i could use throttle without pedaling but not in pas 0 so i'm not sure if my unit has been reprogrammed/hot rodded.

                      seems weird that i cannot get the display to power up at all-any and all suggestions greatly appreciated! i guess the good thing is, all the futzing with the bike makes me really want to build my own now!


                        I'd be suspicious of any cables which have multiple tiny wires inside, which were tightly bent. That won't hurt power cables, but the controller and display cables are kind of fragile. In your pic there is one such cable tightly bent. That may have intermittent connection?

                        If you can monitor voltage at the power wires going into the motor (after all battery connections) while you test, you might learn something. IF the motor had solid voltage with everything connected, but the display won't turn on, then I think we can rule out a power wiring issue as the immediate cause for 'no display function'.

                        You can simply poke the meter probes into the POWER cable insulation to get a reading, but it's best to then seal the holes back up so you won't get corrosion. Don't try that with the control wiring. And whatever you do, don't short the connection out while testing. That can arc and hurt you.

                        You really should verify pack voltage is high enough, as mentioned above, too.
                        Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.


                        • Louis
                          Louis commented
                          Editing a comment
                          There was a case on ES and I had one where the cable WAS pinched hard enough to damage. In one case it shorted out the system. One wire DOES carry power.

                        • limhrod
                          limhrod commented
                          Editing a comment
                          shorted out the system, as in, fried the controller? battery? everything?

                        thanks very much. you are right that the cables were tightly bent/crimped and though i was able to test i want to swap out the harness to see if that's my problem i've got a friend with a load tester so will try to confirm the battery strength . i noticed that sometimes when i put the battery back in the cradle that the power on light (arctic blue) will flash repeatedly. eventually it will go back to solid on if i turn it off and on again but not sure if that's giving me a signal that something is amiss? i'll try to find a youtube video on testing the power cable insulation-so far i've been afraid to test anything with the battery in b/c i'm pretty ignorant about how the meter works! thanks again for the suggestions


                        • limhrod
                          limhrod commented
                          Editing a comment
                          thanks. definitely still confused. i took my meter to the battery and it read 4.36 volts? wonder if that translates to 43.6 and i just don't know how to read my meter-ha. seems weird b/c i've ridden less than 3 miles since last time i had (what i assumed) was a fully charged battery.

                          i've noticed that my dolphin pack light up battery gauge was reading 3 (out of 4) green bars-so i put the battery on the charger while i was working on the bike and the charger has the solid green light on (supposed to mean "charged" ). i assumed that meant the battery was mostly charged but could still be trickling in or balancing even though it didn't show/sound like it was doing anything. so i checked out the charger connections,fuse, wiggled wires etc..hooked it back up and now i can get the charger to turn on (fan goes on, light goes to red). sooo, gonna give it a few hours and see if maybe the battery not being charged was the whole issue.

                          so, does the BMS, or low charged battery, not allow anything to switch on-not even the display?
                          i've got the watt meter now and still looking on youtube for tips on using it on the bike. was thinking i could put it in between the anderson connectors that connect my battery to the wire coming out of the bbso2 and see if i can get any reading. seems unlikely that any load is there if i can't even get the display to fire up.

                          any suggestions on how to rig up a load tester appropriate for a bike pack?

                        • JPLabs
                          JPLabs commented
                          Editing a comment
                          4.36V is lower than you should ever see, makes me wonder if the BMS is interfering. Tripped? I don't know if it passes any voltage if tripped, but it's something you can probably find more info about here. Sorry I don't know more, but I haven't experienced that myself.

                          Low battery will certainly prevent anything from powering up, yes. And will cause cutouts under high load, even if there is enough voltage to run the motor at low loads.

                          Full battery is step one for any troubleshooting.

                          "any suggestions on how to rig up a load tester appropriate for a bike pack?"

                          Load testing your pack requires a load which nears, but won't exceed, the current delivery capability of the BMS. To pull 30A at 48V would require a resistance of 1.6 Ohms. And that resistor needs to be able to dissipate about 1.5 kW of heat. That's not something you can just buy cheaply and ready made. Then you need to monitor current and voltage to learn anything.

                          You COULD rig something up, but I wouldn't recommend it. Maybe if you are a rancher you can use the top wire of your barbed wire fence, around a big enough corral to have enough wire for 1.6 Ohms? Kidding, mostly. But a long wire with sufficient cooling is basically what's used for resistive loads. Now you need to be able to connect and DISCONNECT it without arcing........

                          An electric space heater or two could be about right, too. Or 32 car headlights wired up right (4sx8p array).

                          If you know what you are doing, enough that the above is familiar to you, it's possible. Difficult and dangerous to DIY . I answered your question for illustration, but please don't do it :) Even though running 32 headlights would be really impressive!

                          Really, though, I don't think you need a load tester. Your motor is a pretty ideal load. If you get power to the motor and controller at the right voltage, it will turn on, even if the pack is pretty weak. After that, riding it is your load testing. Just focus on voltage for now. Later, when it's all working, if you go WOT and it cuts out, then we can focus on why it won't handle a high load.
                          Last edited by JPLabs; 09-04-2016, 07:39 AM.

                        • limhrod
                          limhrod commented
                          Editing a comment
                          thanks jpl! will look up BMS and see what i can find. at least now i see that i can test my battery and that it is fully charged. i tried to turn it on this morning and still no luck. i keep hoping there is a fuse tripped somewhere..

                        newbie question, couldn't find the answer on youtube. can i disconnect the anderson connectors and check the battery with the meter by putting the probes on each side? which setting do i put on the meter? or is this why i need a load tester?


                          Yes red probe to red side Black to black.