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Aerial adventures with the BBSO2/Montague,RANS S7-S combo

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    #16


    I have an electrified Montague as well. However, I think the 20" folders are the best. I have 2 Dahon Mariners with the BBS02 conversion. Total weight is 44 lbs. A few years ago, my Montague weighed 80 lbs. It was too much of a burden to use with the airplane. I only ended up towing it with me a few times.

    1. 20" fit in the plane easier.
    2. 20" work well in a city environment, where you may have to ride on the sidewalk. They can much more easily navigate around people, and people feel less threatened by them. Even walking with the 20" in a urban environment is much much easier.
    3. I have gotten the Dahon up to 35 mph downhill, and I was surprised at how stable it was.

    Hoping my next conversion is even smaller and lighter. Actually, i have been eyeing that mini battery pack at only 3 lbs! That would save me 7 lbs right there. ;)

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      #17


      My Montague weighs 48 lbs, including the battery bag. I should have said the Montague is best for my purposes. Like today, up on some rocky shale at 8,000', I don't ride city much, but I agree, for that smaller is better, even 16" wheels perhaps, but for when the road runs out, I want a full sized bike. It does 33 mph on the level, and I've had it well over 50 mph down hill. I also like the way it looks like a regular bike, when I ride my fat tired 20" Trail Viper it draws a whole lot of attention, depending on the mood I'm in and what I'm doing this may or may not matter! The Montague looks "normal" and flies under the radar, even other bikers don't see, right off anyway, that it's a folder.



      I was carrying two batteries today, in the below picture you can see one of them on the jury strut. They are in fire resistant padded bags. Even if in the extremely unlikely scenario of them having some kind of an issue while in flight, they won't cause any problems. This site was a bit over 8,000', On a neighboring ridge I saw a herd of elk, about 50 of them. I was trying to ride to the top of a pass and ended up taking a wrong turn but did make it to the top of a lesser pass. Once back at the plane I flew the route I had just biked, and saw where the trail I wanted was, where I had went wrong, and also where several other branches ended up. Kind of like using Google Earth but a lot more detail!



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        #18
        Nice. I agree the Montague is better for that terrain. Nice to see you have the Travoy as well, which i love, too. You have a very nice setup for touring the entire backcountry.

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          #19
          Yes, am impressed you are able to get that Montague into your S7. You have a great combo there with the ebike mtn bike and the off airport capable plane. And I love your pics, very inspiring.

          Comment


            #20
            Last weekend I flew into one of the biggest fly-ins of the year for back country type aircraft, held at Johnson Creek, right next to the Frank Church Wilderness area. I had some fun on the way also, making several landings on mountain sides, before getting to the area where I wanted to ride a dirt road that goes up and over the Lost River Range, this was another ride that I had first noticed from the air. Once into e biking, it was on my list to ride, it's a very long list and I'm hitting them as fast as I can! I saved a 5 mile ride on the highway from the nearby airport (boring) by finding a spot on the scrub lands at the base of the range that was right close to the dirt road, so all my riding was almost immediately uphill.

            Dirt and gravel, with some rocks, and didn't see another soul, a typical Idaho ride. 2500' or so of vert climb, and once on top the view into the big valley on the other side was, though I've seen it before many times, still frigging awesome. Not hot, cool, about 55, a great day for a ride.



            The pic showing the bike on the edge of the cliff shows the valley to the west, and another big range, which I rode up later in the day after coming down from the first ride, packing up the bike, and flying over to the airport proper. Then I had lunch and got a motel room, and kicked back for a bit. Fired up again, I rode the second big range another 2 500 to 3 K vert with more views etc. etc. And a great ride down of course. So, about 5K vert for the day, and the "little" BBSO2/Montague combo handled it easily, what a great setup (though my new Montague with the Roloff hub and the BBSHD will be even greater).

            Next morning, I flew into the Frank Church, the largest wilderness area in the lower 48. I landed one strip called Soldier Bar, got the bike out (but didn't unfold it and sure as hell didn't ride) as that is a huge no no in the official wilderness, you can't even use a wheelbarrow back there! I got a picture just so I could say I had a e bike in a wilderness area, a hot topic (they all are) with the single track e bike haters over at mtbr.com ha ha. Here is a pic of some of the planes there, about 70, a lot of the biggest and baddest STOL aircraft in the US, including the latest Cub Crafter's new Xcub and the company president, more on him later. At one point I rode into and back from the small village of Yellow Pine, 5 miles away along a great river, people seemed to think that was a big deal! They really did when I told them I could easily have done it 2 or 3 more times according to my watt meter! I could see it slowly sinking in "either this old fart is in some kind of fantastic shape, or these ebikes bear looking into."

            Now, I had expected a bit of interest from other pilots in my e folder, but wow, I was not expecting the reaction it got. We all know the joy of turning a newbie on to them, and getting that e grin from them in return, this was that but to the max! The prez of Cub Crafters had to be cajoled into taking a spin, but then he didn't come back for 10 minutes, obviously enthralled with the smooth silent propulsion of the BBS02. Various infamous characters in the back country flying world, friends of mine, took it for a spin, and all of a sudden I was a real popular guy at the dinner that night. I was even asked to stand up, take the mike (they had a big raffle drawing later) and blab e bikes for a bit (giving Luna a huge plug). It was rewarding for me, I mean I was pretty sure a folding e mountain bike in a plane was a damn good idea and I was sure having fun with mine, but it was good to see my peers, as it were, agree! If.... I had had a half dozen new Montagues all converted and ready to ride, I could have sold them all, no kidding. So, to sum up, my first big foray with the e bike into the flying world populace was a huge hit. Over and beyond the purely selfish fun I had riding that weekend, it was a blast to turn others onto the possibilities of a folding e bike for their plane, and e bikes in general.






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            • wklatt
              wklatt commented
              Editing a comment
              Wow, and more wow, with those pics. Thanks for sharing. Yes, great combo there, mtn ebike and off airport flying. No surprise at the flying crowd reaction. One guy at our airport got an ebike, and now several have them (with more to come) and which is how I got started. Luna should show up with a folding ebike at a few fly-ins, and I bet they could sell several kits right on the spot. Just need to seed a few at various airports, and they will spread very quickly, I'm sure.

            #21
            I was up in Montana over the weekend, at a small town fly in that also had the local RC aircraft guys on display. Plus a guy with a homebuilt trike, and of course the usual pilots. The trike builder got more and more interested in the concept of power assist, when I pointed out his rig was perfect for the Bafang mid drive. In 10 minutes he went from not interested at all..... aloof to the concept at first, to VERY interested, he was a sharp guy and the mechanical challenge appealed to him I think. Many of the pilots and most of the RC guys took the bike for a spin.

            I'm sure others are experiencing this also, having an e bike these days is like some new kind of super power, wherever you go you now have the ability to make new friends and leave people smiling. It's like walking around with a box full of kittens or puppies, nobody can resist smiling! I think Eric with Luna experiences this on a mega scale, selling the equipment to make those smiles, we individuals get to do the same on a one to one basis. It's really an unexpected sideline benefit in it's way. On one of the 5 times I got the bike out of the plane during this trip, I was at another small town, and when I rode up to the gas station, every pump was being used by a group of bikers, the Harley type of bikers. I was pulling the Travoy trailer with the fuel bladder, and I of course got some attention. I immediately started giving them a hard time, especially one guy who was next in line to fuel, and started his hog up to ride the 5' to the pump, "that wasn't much of a ride!" Then I sort of cut in line by pointing out I only needed a few gallons, and the gas along with the bike and trailer, would all be packed into my homebuilt plane a couple miles away and when I got done I'd catch up with them and ride along for a bit. This got their attention (and distracted them enough to let me cut in line) most Harley riders like airplanes, go figure. I wish I had a picture of my ebike with the hogs, it was an odd combination of 2 wheeled rides. Unfortunately, after they blasted off and I packed up and launched, as I played catchup, a fork in the road left me wondering which way they went, and I chose wrong. Too bad, I've flown along (off to the side, enough to keep it legal, in open country, about 30' up) with a pack of bikers often, it's great fun, especially on a twisty hilly road, we are all out to have a good time so what the hell.

            I got my voltage converter wired up, "Solar Converters" (http://www.solarconverters.com/) did a fine job of modding one their stock units, Dan nailed my asked for specs exactly. I have long used this outfit for odd ball low voltage items in my sideline solar business, been using their gear for decades now. It charges my 52 battery at a bit under 3 amps, using my aircraft's 12 VDC system. It only works when the input power is above 13+ volts, which is perfect because I'm at 13.9 VDC inflight, and if I forget to shut off the charger when landed, it won't suck my plane battery empty! I mounted it where I could reach it in the cockpit, the concept being once aloft, the plugged in battery (the cabling is simply taped to the underside of the lift strut, "crude, but primitive") will slowly charge as I fly along. The amp rate for the 52 v battery was chosen based on the (small) excess charge capacity of the airplane, and I am real pleased to get well over 2 amps/almost 3, much better then nothing! I installed a lighted rocker switch and the appropriate fusing as required.

            The charging battery in flight at 9,000', outside temps were 34 degrees.


            The black box is the converter, I can quickly pull it out when not needed using the wiring disconnects, finding room for it was easier then I thought, it's totally out of the way.


            At the towered Missoula airport, prior to a 14 miles round trip into town, a father and son owned pair of biz jets, Nevada casino guys I was told. Interesting......but not my type of airport or flying.

            Now this is more like it, a gravel bar landing.



            If anyone wants to make a road trip to Montana, you HAVE TO check out the Gravelly Range (spelling is correct, http://wilderthanagrizzlysdream.blog...n-montana.html), I have only low level flown it, but it would make a killer e bike ride. I WILL be riding it, but it will be a major expedition and may involve shuttle vehicles, we'll see. Awesome scenery and nobody up there! This pic was taken right at 9,000', the road itself is just gentle grades undulating along the very high ridge, mostly 8 to 9K.

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              #22
              Charger setup is perfect with the low voltage cutoff - and using solar power gear gets bonus points for thinking out of the box, in my book. Cool.

              I enjoyed your comments about other people's reactions. I'm always watching for good local ride destinations. I think I'll start looking up small area airports. I don't fly, but I do love watching planes, and it will be nice to be able to bring something of interest to that crowd, to talk about.

              Great that they made you make a little speech about ebikes!
              Fabrication is fun! Build something today. Show someone. Let them help. Inspire and share. Spread the desire.

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                #23
                An update.....looks like I may have waited too long to hit the Gravelly Range ride, I'm pretty sure it's snowed in already! Next year......

                But I still have had a really good time with the plane/bike combo this year. Except for last weekend. I flew into a grass strip about 120 miles away, in a narrow canyon in the middle of the tallest ranges in Idaho. There are a half dozen cabins strung out along the strip, and I've been in there 4 or 5 times over the last 15 years mountain biking the forest service roads and trails all around and have yet to see anyone at the cabins. This was one of my much anticipated rides of the season. Now technically, the strip is "private", it's not listed on any charts anyway, and I have just invited myself in, poached it, in effect, but hey it's not like there is a big sign saying KEEP OUT or anything, and most pilots are a clannish and friendly bunch and odds are very much in my favor that if and when I run into one of the cabin owners, it would be a non issue.

                So, I flew in (field elevation 7400' ASL), got the Montague out and ready, and this time I was taking my 6 AH Mini, my 11.5 AH frame mounted, and an additional 11.5 AH batteries, the later being strapped to my seat post rack. Then I brewed a real strong cup of coffee. Now I was ready to ride! The plan was to get up to at least 10,000', maybe higher, well that didn't happen.

                The dirt road that services the cabins winds from the main dirt road, and when I started my epic ride, I had noted that as usual, no one was at any of the cabins, the place was dead. But....when I got to where the access road met the main road, there was a closed steel gate! This gate had never been closed before, or not even there maybe, for sure not locked anyway, like it now was. My first inclination was to climb over it, but then I started thinking: I still had a bum shoulder from my crash of a month ago, making me phsically wimpy for lifting anyway. I'd need to take all the batteries off and lighten the load as much as possible to be able to lift the bike over the 5' gate, then put it all together again on the other side of course. Then do it all again on my return. But with one crucial difference, this time I wouldn't be breaking OUT of the compound (somewhat morally justified), but breaking IN. And that tipped the morality scales for me, sure I'd be "justified", as my plane was there, but it just didn't pass the sniff test. I will push things a bit in situations where I deem I am doing no harm, and no one will care even if they knew what I was doing, but this would have been a bit much even for me. So after a feeble effort looking for a fence section in disrepair enough to slide the bike through (no luck) I realized my ride was over before it started. All coffeed up, and with 29 AH of 100% charged up 52 volt battery, and with 7 hours of daylight left, I bagged it. Like a trucker jacked up on coffee and cross tops, but now his truck won't start. It was a tough call, but the right one. I was back home in a couple hours, and ended up having a great local ride anyway so still a good day.

                Since this happened last weekend, in relating the story to a flying buddy in the Sun Valley area, he mentioned that he knew one of the cabin owners, so next time "I'll make arrangements," in advance. A few pictures from other flying bike trips this year follow:[URL=http://s649.photobucket.com/user/simkot/media/IMG_20160805_182206_zpsndttr0pb.jpg.html][/U

                The first is of a 8800' mountain top I've landed the plane on, and It later occurred to me it'd be a fun fat bike ride also. My place is on the range across the valley, so I look at this peak out the living room window every day, and one day I decided it needed to be landed on. Then, I decided it needed to be biked. Now when I look at it, I think "been there, done that."
                The second was in Montana, and thanks to the security gate, which was weight activated to open to get OUT, (and they weren't thinking bikes, even heavy e bikes) so I had to climb that fence to get out and use the keypad code from the outside, which I had, to open the damn thing. A crop duster based there I met later thought that was hilarious, and also really liked the folding ebike and how riding into town and back was "no sweat."
                The third is of a mountain canyon near a crane job I was doing, that I first earlier flew over and checked out for riding. The day of the crane job I got there early and fat biked it. So, these pics are a mix of crane/fatbike/plane/Montague jobs/flights/rides, it's all fun.

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                  #24
                  A few more, it's raining and I can't fly, bike, or work, and this is what happens. Bayhorse mine at 8600'


                  Rail trail near the Grand Tetons, I landed in a nearby hayfield.


                  Also at 8600', near Copper Basin, both these rides I ended up well above 9K, you got to love the lack of density altitude effects on electric motors!

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                    #25
                    Keep the photos coming I love this thread. No hill here in Perth.

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                      #26
                      Somewhat connected with the flying theme, I recently got a killer deal on a used PLUG IN Prius, the significance of it being a plug in (10 to 15 miles pure EV range) is significant for me as I have "free" electricity, a surplus of it, both at home and my crane yard in town 13 miles away. I quickly adapted it to efficiently carry the same Montague I carry in the plane, by removing the passenger front seat. Any passengers sit in back, and have plenty of leg room! So now I have a ebike transporter that is low drag (about the lowest drag coefficient on the road I think) with NO added drag from a (gasp) roof top carrier, or even (better) a rear carrier.

                      So, on days when I can't fly as planned due to crap weather, I load the bike in the car (with all kinds of room left over for camping gear etc. PLUS room to sleep inside of it) and hit the road. I can charge the bike batteries enroute with a 400 watt inverter, and when parked in my shop I often have the car and the bike batteries charging at the same time, while still producing more power at the moment then I'm consuming (go solar). Yesterday it was the Big Southern Butte, out in the high desert about 60 miles away from home. I used to fly hang gliders off there 30 years ago, make that 35 years ago, and it had been that long since I had stood on top, though I often fly over it. 2500' vert up a brutal steep and rocky road, with the closet help if you have a problem a long ways away. It was late in the day, with rain or snow coming, so this was going to be a balls out throttle up as fast as possible, screw PAS for this ride. I had the 6 AH Mini in it's usual place, along with a 11.5 AH Panasonic hung from the frame. PLUS, another 11.5 AH in my backpack, which is about the 10 th. time I've brought it and never came close to needing it.

                      I didn't keep any accurate track of amp hours consumed or average speed, let's just say I didn't care about the first and as for the second, around double digits. The MINI got me to within the last 1/2 mile or so, I gave it a break when the voltage was showing 46.8 v while under load. It quickly rebounded to 50+ when I gave it a rest. It took about 15 seconds to unplug it and plug in the fully charged replacement. When I crested the top and pulled up along side a couple in an SUV that passed me on the way when I was still driving the Prius (rare to see anyone, this is a brutal place and the wind was blowing the usual 30+ mph) I expected them to be astonished at my physical fitness, as I wasn't even breathing hard. But, the guy was a bike rider, and soon to be an ebike rider he said, and he had spotted me on my ride up and noted I wasn't pedaling, so I couldn't fool them.

                      The motor never got warm, or the battery. The 11.5 AH battery never got below 56 v, with all the extra capacity I had with me I could have climbed, at the speed I was going up and at the same consistantly steep slope, another 10,000' of vert! Without any undue deep discharge of the batteries. I could have made it to the summit just on the Mini, so by my very rough figuring, I came up with 416' of vert per AH, (2500' divided by 6 AH)so 416 times another 23 AH I was carrying= 9568'. This was with NO pedaling, zero, zip, nada. Coming down, the disc brakes got a very deep dark color, and were too hot to touch even with gloves, once cooled they returned to their their normal color, interesting. The Rohloff hub proved it's worth here, having the exact gear I needed at any time, at least I enjoyed thinking it helped a lot though really it was just a minor factor probably. This new capability of being able to get to where I think I need to be to start a ride, in a high MPG way as is currently possible given my budget (I got 79 mpg on the first leg of the trip, 52 coming back, and that was with a fair bit of 72 mph freeway travel in a lot of wind, some of it helping, some hurting), can be seen as a safety thing. If I get up in the morning with a big ride planned, one that was going to start with flying there, but the weather is crap or maybe even "iffy", I am now much less likely to push it. I'll leave the plane in the hangar, after first taking out the usual camping gear I also carry in it, which all fits in the car with enough room for the dog and still have room to sleep inside of it, wow. Like a mini high MPG camper, with a bad ass ebike inside, for max stealth and low drag, lot's of possibilities for fun with this setup.
                      Last edited by CPG; 10-17-2016, 09:27 AM.

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                        #27
                        Thank You for sharing. Awesome pics. Highly inspiring. Can't wait to get out tomorrow.

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                          #28
                          Yes Love your thread

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                            #29
                            I've been making the most of the last of the good flying and biking weather, they go together, actually, I can ride in pretty crappy weather. A lot worse then I can fly in anyway, but when it's good for both I take advantage of it.

                            This is yet another ghost mining camp, again located very high up and in a remote area. It boggles my mind to think of how tough the miners were to do what they did with the primitive equipment they had to work with. It had to be one dangerous occupation, hell, it still is! After finding a landing spot below the mine camp, I had a couple mile ride to get to "downtown", the big building is the old post office. At one point this was a thriving community, with even a rail line going to nearby Montana. On the ride up to the lake pictured, I went back into the mine shaft as far as I could/dared. At one point it occurred to me that if I had had a bike headlamp, I could have rode down it at 30 mph and see where it ended up, next time, yeah right.

                            The lake up top, near 10,000', is pristine, crystal clear, and is snowed in by now. The eMontague gobbled up the two wheel drive gravel road, about 2500' above the ghost town, it continues to perform miraculously. I know many say they only need a very few gears, and that's true, but when you have 14 like with the Rohloff IGH the Montague has, you take advantage of them. It was great being able to keep shifting up, little by little, going faster and faster, until the perfect sweet spot of pedal effort, amp draw, speed, and fun was reached. The ride down was great also, as it wasn't so steep that I had to stay on the brakes ALL the time, like many of my mountain rides, and I was able to average about 30 coming down, more or less safely. 14 miles round trip over all.

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                              #30
                              Originally posted by CPG View Post
                              I've been making the most of the last of the good flying and biking weather, they go together, actually, I can ride in pretty crappy weather. A lot worse then I can fly in anyway, but when it's good for both I take advantage of it.

                              This is yet another ghost mining camp, again located very high up and in a remote area. It boggles my mind to think of how tough the miners were to do what they did with the primitive equipment they had to work with. It had to be one dangerous occupation, hell, it still is! After finding a landing spot below the mine camp, I had a couple mile ride to get to "downtown", the big building is the old post office. At one point this was a thriving community, with even a rail line going to nearby Montana. On the ride up to the lake pictured, I went back into the mine shaft as far as I could/dared. At one point it occurred to me that if I had had a bike headlamp, I could have rode down it at 30 mph and see where it ended up, next time, yeah right.

                              The lake up top, near 10,000', is pristine, crystal clear, and is snowed in by now. The eMontague gobbled up the two wheel drive gravel road, about 2500' above the ghost town, it continues to perform miraculously. I know many say they only need a very few gears, and that's true, but when you have 14 like with the Rohloff IGH the Montague has, you take advantage of them. It was great being able to keep shifting up, little by little, going faster and faster, until the perfect sweet spot of pedal effort, amp draw, speed, and fun was reached. The ride down was great also, as it wasn't so steep that I had to stay on the brakes ALL the time, like many of my mountain rides, and I was able to average about 30 coming down, more or less safely. 14 miles round trip over all.
                              I posted 5 pics, and just see three, but a clickable link shows I posted 5? Anyway, click on that link to see the last 2 pics, I also just noticed that my comments under the pics don't show unless the pic is clicked on.
                              Last edited by CPG; 10-24-2016, 08:46 AM.

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