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    #16
    Tires lose air. You can treat leaks but rubber is still porous. If you are losing air over days you likely have a small leak. If over weeks it's normal.

    I don't get leaks anymore (see previous posts in this thread) and every few weeks lose a couple of psi (out of 10-12psi). I think it's worse with high pressure skinny tires since they have a lot less volume per surface area and similarly this is why car tires take longer (but still continuously lose air the same way) since they are lower pressure and have gobs of volume. I also think people notice it more in the high pressure tires since let's say you run 80psi and lose 20% and you say "yikes, that's 16psi!" but if I lose 20%, that's only about 2psi and your eyes glaze over and say "so what? It's just 2psi" even though it's still 20% and makes similar changes to handling, rolling resistance, suppleness, wear, etc...
    Last edited by AZguy; 06-06-2018, 08:24 AM.

    Comment


      #17
      If you already have battery powered tools, maybe your brand of choice has a inflator tool. One of the brands I use is Ryobi, so I have one of these:

      Click image for larger version  Name:	CR-Cars-Inline-Tire-Inflator-Ryobi-08-17.jpg Views:	1 Size:	52.4 KB ID:	66412



      Make the job easy-peasy. Even comes with a Presta valve adapter.

      Comment


      • AZguy
        AZguy commented
        Editing a comment
        Goes to show how pointless nitrogen would be in my tires that are already full of liquid and water. I knew the dry part was the main advantage and it makes sense that likely not anywhere near as poorly as CO2 it fluctuates more with temperature when it's wet.

      • MoneyPit
        MoneyPit commented
        Editing a comment
        The biggest thing about nitrogen is it doesn't expand when it heats up. But you have to be running on a race track to care. And even then... if you aren't on a pro team you still don't care.

        Thicker tubes, or bigger ones, a little slime inside... Job done on these newfangled fat tires. I can remember on my 120 psi 20c tires with thin light tubes, pumping them up another 20 psi every single day was just a part of life. Its what bike tires do.

      • Rider
        Rider commented
        Editing a comment
        That is a sweet little battery powered trigger air pump. Do you know if Dewalt makes one like that with a gauge? My quick searches came up empty. All my battery tools are Dewalt.

      #18

      Wednesday's Tire Pressures Update!


      As of 6-6-2018...To recap. At this time I just changed my back tube with a thorn proof over sized one. It's been on the bike for a week. I try to take a couple mile bike ride every day. I plan on getting digital tire pressure readings once a week. My base line is skewed right off the bat :-( as I forgot to get the ambient temperature at the time of the first test and I started off 1 PSI low. Keep in mind, I'm doing my best to take a quick, solid one time reading...with the tires cold (setting awhile). but nothings perfect. Once read for the week, will reset to 40 PSI and start again. Bike rests on single stand.

      …...…......……...……..Ambient Temperature / Front Tire / Back Tire Corrective Action...…………………………..Comments:
      Base Line: 5-30-2018 UNKNOWN …………….39.0 PSI...… 39 PSI.. New Back Tube Installed
      6-6-2018...………….. 77 degrees ………......…35.0 PSI...… 30 PSI...Tightened Schrader Valve Cores (both)......Loss of 4 PSI front and 9 PSI back, seems excessive.
      6-13-2018...………… 75 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...… 38 PSI... Tightened cores a bit more (maximum) Added new valve stem caps with seals. Making progress! Loss -3.5 PSI front -2 PSI back.
      See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

      Comment


      • MoneyPit
        MoneyPit commented
        Editing a comment
        Valve stem caps shouldn't matter. Next move should be some kind of sealant inside the tube. I like to use Slime not because its functionally the best but because it has a 2-year lifespan. Check into how long whatever it is you are considering lasts and then decide what to put in there.

      #19

      Wednesday's Tire Pressures Update!


      As of 6-6-2018...To recap. At this time I just changed my back tube with a thorn proof over sized one. It's been on the bike for a week. I try to take a couple mile bike ride every day. I plan on getting digital tire pressure readings once a week. My base line is skewed right off the bat :-( as I forgot to get the ambient temperature at the time of the first test and I started off 1 PSI low. Keep in mind, I'm doing my best to take a quick, solid one time reading...with the tires cold (setting awhile). but nothings perfect. Once read for the week, will try improvements recommended then reset to 40 PSI and start again. Bike rests on single stand.

      …...…......……...……..Ambient Temperature / Front Tire / Back Tire Corrective Action...…………………………..Comments:
      Base Line: 5-30-2018 UNKNOWN …………….39.0 PSI...… 39 PSI.. New Back Tube Installed
      6-6-2018...………….. 77 degrees ………......…35.0 PSI...… 30 PSI...Tightened Schrader Valve Cores (both)......Loss of 4 PSI front and 9 PSI back, seems excessive.
      6-13-2018...………… 75 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...… 38 PSI... Tightened cores a bit more (maximum) Added new valve stem caps with seals. Making progress! Loss -3.5 PSI front -2 PSI back.
      6-20-2018...………… 77 degrees...……………37.0 PSI...….38 PSI... Added Stans tire sealant to front tube. Finally adding some Stans! No change with new caps. Loss -3 PSI front -2 PSI back
      See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

      Comment


        #20
        FWIIW I installed the new Finish Line Life-of-the-Tire sealant in my Surly Extraterrestrial 29X2.5 tires tubeless and I’m not losing any noticeable air. My guess is the rather thin liquid sealant seals up the tires porous nature pretty well and prevents air loss. I can’t comment on this sealants ability to plug punctures, as I haven’t had any yet. Many reviews claim it isn’t as good as the ones that have to be replaced every 3-6 months on punctures. My LBS has been mixing Stan’s or other sealant with the Finish Line if he gets a puncture that won’t seal and says that has been working well. I plan to get a couple 2oz. bottles of Stan’s to carry with me just in case. Who knows, I may never need to add it, but I’d rather be prepared just in case.
        MOVING BACK TO PEDAL...
        2020 Banshee Paradox V3 1x11 (pedal)
        2018 Soma Wolverine 3spd IGH Belt Drive (pedal)

        Comment


          #21
          Wednesday's Tire Pressures Update!


          As of 6-6-2018...To recap. At this time I just changed my back tube with a thorn proof over sized one. It's been on the bike for a week. I try to take a couple mile bike ride every day. I plan on getting digital tire pressure readings once a week. My base line is skewed right off the bat :-( as I forgot to get the ambient temperature at the time of the first test and I started off 1 PSI low. Keep in mind, I'm doing my best to take a quick, solid one time reading...with the tires cold (setting awhile). but nothings perfect. Once read for the week, will try improvements recommended then reset to 40 PSI and start again. Bike rests on single stand.

          …...…......……...……..Ambient Temperature / Front Tire / Back Tire Corrective Action...…………………………..Comments:
          Base Line: 5-30-2018 UNKNOWN …………….39.0 PSI...… 39 PSI.. New Back Tube Installed
          6-6-2018...………….. 77 degrees ………......…35.0 PSI...… 30 PSI...Tightened Schrader Valve Cores (both)......Loss of 4 PSI front and 9 PSI back, seems excessive.
          6-13-2018...………… 75 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...… 38 PSI... Tightened cores a bit more (maximum) Added new valve stem caps with seals. Making progress! Loss -3.5 PSI front -2 PSI back.
          6-20-2018...………… 77 degrees...……………37.0 PSI...….38 PSI... Added Stans tire sealant to front tube. Finally adding some Stans! No change with new caps. Loss -3 PSI front -2 PSI back
          6-27-2018...………… 76 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...….38.5 PSI. Added Stans to the back tube. No improvement in front :-( Loss front -3.5 back -1.5
          See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

          Comment


            #22
            I've about had it with tubes! I reinstalled at pair of tires and tubes on my ride that had sat for a few months while I tried another tire out mounted tubeless. I mounted them both up, but both went flat within a few minutes. This was puzzling to me. After disassembling them I found that the thought to be quality Schwalbe tubes rubber appears to be separating and becoming porous ON THE RIM SIDE (see photo). You can hear the air pouring out the rubber!

            Even though the Schwalbe Super Moto-X tires I'm installing say "tube tire" on them, I mounted them up tubeless with Stan's yesterday. Checking them this morning after sitting over night they are still nice and firm, holding air just fine. The Halo Vapour rims they are installed on are tubeless rims. I seem to remember some people saying you can't mount wire bead tires tubeless, but they went on fine and sealed right up. I guess time will tell how this works out...

            Anyone have thoughts or experience mounting non-tubeless tires tubeless?

            Both of these tubes are going to the trash can. I'm done with tubes!
            Attached Files
            Last edited by Rider; 06-28-2018, 05:42 AM.
            MOVING BACK TO PEDAL...
            2020 Banshee Paradox V3 1x11 (pedal)
            2018 Soma Wolverine 3spd IGH Belt Drive (pedal)

            Comment


            • Rider
              Rider commented
              Editing a comment
              Maybe easier if the tube is already installed, but if mounting from scratch it’s easier to eliminate the tube IMHO. I don’t even squeeze it through the valve stem, just pour it in the tire after one side is on the rim, then slide the other tire bead over the rim and inflate. Stan’s in a tube limits the tubes’ life. The new Finish Line Life-of-the-Tire might be a better choice for inside a tube as it won’t dry out.

              What is “Getto-Tubeless?”

            • AZguy
              AZguy commented
              Editing a comment
              Frankly I don't know what could be easier than filling the tubes before installing, giving them enough air to be just inflated enough for no folds, put them in the tires, mount, inflate.

              Stans life hasn't been an issue for me - I need to change tires about once a year and I load it up with about 4x what they call for and necer have had a problem with it drying out. I'm unconvinced that any of the products that advertise life-time are as good as stans. It's pretty amazing. I got home and found half a dozen large thorns in my tire, all between 1/10" and 1/8". No worries, just left them there until the next time on the stand. On the stand pull them out and as soon as it hissing madly releasing gobs of air, hold paper towel over the hole to catch any residual, rotate the wheel until the hole is near the bottom and hissing stops in about a second.

              Ghetto-tubeless is taking tubes and cutting them in half parallel to the axis - i.e. cut them so there's an inside half and an outside half that you toss away. Mount the inner part of the tube with the valve stem sort of like you would do the tape. Mount the tire so that the inner tube flaps between the tire bead and the rim so that the cut end is entirely exposed. Fill with stans and seal like you would with a normal tubeless. After it's been ridden on and holding, trim the inner tube flaps to be flush with the rims. It basically avoids all the taping, valve stem seating/sealing and make's cleanup much easier - one thing that stops me from going tubeless is having to clean up all that nasty crap whenever I change tires - I put 8-16oz in each tire (26 x 4.7").

            • Rider
              Rider commented
              Editing a comment
              Lol... Definitly “Getto!”

            #23

            Just a quote from an online website about mounting a tube...

            Pro Tip
            If the bike is to be ridden in a ‘high performance’ context dusting the inner tube with talcum powder makes the tyre work better as the inner tube can move around more easily inside the tyre. It also makes it easier to fit a borderline too-wide tube without folds or getting stuck under the tyre bead.

            I did it because it made the tube slippery and seemingly easier to install. Especially with the newly installed, over sized, thornproof tube. But was wondering in an earlier post if this may have produced unwanted rubbing on the rim, as this is also where mine developed the leak...

            See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

            Comment


            • Rider
              Rider commented
              Editing a comment
              Interesting...

            • MoneyPit
              MoneyPit commented
              Editing a comment
              Talcum powder (or corn starch) is an old-school thing that has been around for decades. You put a little on your hands, then grab the tube and slide your hands all over the circumference of the tube. Takes about 5 seconds. Helps keep the tube from getting hung up on stuff.

              You can also use a pinch of talc to deal with the sticky spot that is created by the cement that surrounds a tire patch. Even if you let the thing dry its not uncommon on race tires for tubes to weld to the tire. Since talcum powder bottles are seldom on the side of the road while you patch a tire, I have always used a carefully checked (for glass bits) pinch of dirt rubbed over the freshly cemented patch. Problem solved before it happens.

            #24
            I guess with fat-tires I'm just a keep-it-simple kind of guy...


            New tires/tubes:

            Unmount old tires/tubes, chuck everything (<5min)

            Rinse new tubes, fill with stans (<5min)

            Mount tires with stans'ed up tubes on rims and inflate (5-10min)

            Ride! - no repeat =]


            I've done it enough that it really is about a 15min job for both tires that I can stretch out to 20min if I have a beer in my hand and taking my time - this is presuming the bike is already up on the stand for its weekly maintenance and this is just an additional task


            If I were running 120psi super skinny tires on a pedal-only bike (there's no worry that this will ever happen out here) or racing downhill, etc. (no worry here either) then I might do things differently.

            Comment


              #25
              Pump Before You Ride Every Time! Air compressors are a nice investment even a small one, especially if you dont like pumping! I Pump good pre ride work out/er stretch lol! Keep on Biking!
              2018 Motobecane Boris Fat Bike BBSHD Build

              Comment


              • Rider
                Rider commented
                Editing a comment
                You guys are running some seriously low PSI's. I generally run F-35/R-40 with my Surly ET's. Might go F-30/R-35 if off-road riding only.

              • AZguy
                AZguy commented
                Editing a comment
                Hahaha - max rated pressure for my tires is 20psi =]

              • Rider
                Rider commented
                Editing a comment
                That explains a lot...

              #26
              Wednesday's Tire Pressures Update!


              As of 6-6-2018...To recap. At this time I just changed my back tube with a thorn proof over sized one. It's been on the bike for a week. I try to take a couple mile bike ride every day. I plan on getting digital tire pressure readings once a week. My base line is skewed right off the bat :-( as I forgot to get the ambient temperature at the time of the first test and I started off 1 PSI low. Keep in mind, I'm doing my best to take a quick, solid one time reading...with the tires cold (setting awhile). but nothings perfect. Once read for the week, will try improvements recommended then reset to 40 PSI and start again. Bike rests on single stand.

              …...…......……...……..Ambient Temperature / Front Tire / Back Tire Corrective Action...…………………………..Comments:
              Base Line: 5-30-2018 UNKNOWN …………….39.0 PSI...… 39 PSI.. New Back Tube Installed
              6-6-2018...………….. 77 degrees ………......…35.0 PSI...… 30 PSI...Tightened Schrader Valve Cores (both)......Loss of 4 PSI front and 9 PSI back, seems excessive.
              6-13-2018...………… 75 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...… 38 PSI... Tightened cores a bit more (maximum) Added new valve stem caps with seals. Making progress! Loss -3.5 PSI front -2 PSI back.
              6-20-2018...………… 77 degrees...……………37.0 PSI...….38 PSI... Added Stans tire sealant to front tube. Finally adding some Stans! No change with new caps. Loss -3 PSI front -2 PSI back
              6-27-2018...………… 76 degrees...……………36.5 PSI...….38.5 PSI. Added Stans to the back tube. No improvement in front :-( Loss front -3.5 back -1.5
              7-4-2018...…………...80 degrees...…………….0.0 PSI...….37.5 PSI Front tire flat... :-P Ordered new thornproof tube. Loss Front -40 Back -2.5



              Yep, go out to make my pressure checks and the front tire is flat as a pancake. Found a nice little nic on the rim side of the tube close to a nipple. Looks very similar the rear tube failure.





              See any thing wrong with the rim strips?





              So patched the tube with my new patch kit... failed in 5 minutes. 1 o'clock position. A perfect 4 for 4!





              NOW the Stans shows up! Arggggggggggg. (tube position reversed)






              See my completed Magic Pie V5 rear hub motor E-Bike build HERE.

              Comment


                #27
                Are you sure you're not nipping anything with your spoons?

                Comment


                • Tommycat
                  Tommycat commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Good question! Was thinking the same about the back tube as it's been off many times with the motor mounting. But the front...just the opposite. Maybe had it off once...
                  And this tire and tube are soooooo easy to remove, hardly use the spoons at all. Just to get the first start, and always at the valve stem. Far from this hole...

                #28
                For rim strip, I use two layers of fiberglass shipping tape, with the width sized down to fit down in the rim well. I started doing this after noticing the ribber strips (in particular) sinking down into the spoke hole pockets with high pressure tire / tubes.

                Once you define the right width on the tape roll the unused remainder stays behind quite nicely, and one roll does a lot of rims ...

                Comment


                • Tommycat
                  Tommycat commented
                  Editing a comment
                  You've convinced me to build it up a bit. Smooth out the bumps as it were.

                #29
                This is operator error. Not judging. Everyone has to learn sometime and this is your time, Tommycat. Either you are nipping the tube with your levers as noted above, or you are letting the tube get caught between the rim and the tire ('snakebite' puncture, aka 'pinch flat').

                There is no way a flat can happen on its own to a thick Rema patch like that (which looks like it is well-placed and fully stuck on, so you are getting that part right) without there being some serious cutting force applied to it.

                Comment


                  #30
                  also realy check your rims even under the rim strip. I got a rim from hell a few years ago and i literally had to go over the entire rim with a file before putting rim tape on and getting it to work. Oh wait that was that walmart bike lol not saying thats your problem but you never know
                  2018 Motobecane Boris Fat Bike BBSHD Build

                  Comment

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